On The Level Podcast
Some people think Freemasonry is on the decline, not if we have anything to say about it! Join On the Level Podcast as we explore that Esoteric side of Freemasonry. We talk about the inner workings of our Fraternity, how to apply it's teachings to your every day life to become a better man, and general current events. Join our host and guests as we explore Freemasonry together and bring our ancient craft into the modern age!
On The Level Podcast
The Continuing Journey of A Mason (Matt Stone)
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The most recent episode explores the journey of navigating life as a Mason, emphasizing personal growth, the importance of mentorship, and the intricacies of lodge life. From personal struggles in starting a family to the impact of a charter's pull and revitalizing experiences in a new lodge, the discussion reveals valuable insights into maintaining balance in Masonry.
• Personal growth and challenges in Masonry
• The impact of charter pulls on lodge dynamics
• Transitioning to a vibrant environment at Lakeland Lodge
• Importance of mentorship from past masters
• Strategies for engaging younger generations in Freemasonry
• Relevance of Freemasonry in contemporary society
#freemasonry #podcast #brotherhood #bluelodge #freemason
Unlocking Greatness
Speaker 1you've reached the internet's home for all things masonry . Join on the level podcast as we plumb the depths of our ancient craft and try to unlock the mysteries , dispel the fallacies and utilize the teachings of freemasonry to unlock the greatness within each of us .
Speaker 2I have you now let's go . We are back , my brother , we are back .
Speaker 1Are brother . We are back . Are you ready to unlock the greatness within each ?
Speaker 2of us , greatness is a question mark at this point .
Speaker 1Wow , I mean , we have not been on the air for some time . I got butterflies when I heard the intro . I was like whoa , this is cool , I'm not going to lie .
Speaker 2Yeah , my heart started to race a little bit and I was like I have not heard this in so long , like because I went back and watched all of our episodes and it's just really . I miss it , chris , I miss it I do too .
Speaker 1I wonder if anyone else out there misses it . Let's see , this is our , this is our comeback tour um . We haven't posted any new content since sometime last year we have to go back and check that .
Speaker 2What was our last episode we had winding stairs on . I remember that one . We had mikey on before that talked about the aliens . That was fun yeah , well , yeah , that was the aliens , and then the ghosts yep , yep , that was the same .
Speaker 1Go back and listen , guys , especially now we got new jersey drones hey , yeah , with allegedly gravitical propulsion , whatever .
Speaker 2Whatever that is .
Speaker 1Anti-gravity . Is that what it is ?
Speaker 2Man . So , chris , how have you been buddy ? I mean , you and I have talked offline but officially . How was your Christmas ? How was your New Year ? How are things , man ?
Speaker 1Things are good for me . Business is keeping me going . I'm still pretty involved with the Scottish Rite in Florida . I sit on a board and we manage a building for the Scottish Rite there , so I interface . My Masonic stuff is a lot of administrative stuff these days , which you know . I got to do an installation at my lodge , which was exciting . Sorry , you couldn't make it . I think you had a degree or something going on that night yeah , yep but we had a good time and yeah , just life's keeping me busy .
Speaker 1Wife is good , family's good . Uh , I cannot complain how about you ?
Speaker 2good , but would anybody really care ?
Speaker 1you know , we all want to think it's all about us , but no , nobody would care .
Speaker 2I care , chris , I care .
Speaker 1Thank you . No , everything's good , man . As you know , I'm going through some hormone treatments because we're trying to have a baby , so I'm more a woman than a man these days . Nice , I'm holding it , trying to grow up . Look , no chest hair , it's all going away .
Speaker 2Ladies and gentlemen , I introduce you to Christina Burns . My daughter's name ironically Nice . How are you man ? What have you been ?
Speaker 1up to .
Speaker 2I'm great . So New Year's Christmas was all . So Christmas was great . You know , we got my three-year-old daughter a purple and pink bike for Christmas . Because Santa doesn't give her the good stuff , mom and dad give her the good stuff . So yeah , so Santa gave like a . Paul Patrol gift .
Speaker 1Always really ticked me off that my wife always made the good gifts go to Santa .
Speaker 2Yeah , no , we don't play that in my house . No , mom and dad do the good stuff .
Speaker 1Xbox . Why would Santa give him an ?
Speaker 2Xbox . But it's funny , though , because she's's three . She weighs a whopping 27 pounds , so she's not even big enough like she will like . If you're watching this on video , this is great , so let's she'll like stand up like stomp on the on the pedal to try to get the bike to move . And she can't get the bike to move , dang . So it's like all right , baby , you're gonna have to grow into this one . I'm sorry , sorry . She's three , yeah three .
Speaker 1Well , that's young . That's young for bike riding right .
Speaker 2Like no right . The problem is she's very smart and I don't say this because she's my kid , I'm saying this objectively . So before she ever went into school she knew her ABCs , it's good , she got some things from her mother . Right , I mean currently she can count to 30 without missing a beat . We're teaching her how to spell like little three-letter words so she can spell mom , cat and dad . Nice , so we're still working on the hand .
Speaker 1And that's probably the order she loves things in too . Yeah , Mom , cat and dad .
Speaker 2So no , but she's remarkably articulate and she's a problem solver and she's also very logical , which pisses me off . Why does that piss you off ?
Speaker 1You're pretty logical dude .
Speaker 2I'm very logical , but it's one of those things where it's like , if you don't do what I asked you to do , I'm going to Sparta kick you into next week . You know the way our boomer parents threatened us .
Speaker 1I don't know if I should be offended or not . I have employees that literally call everybody boomers and I'm like , wait , I'm feel like I'm dangerously close to being a boomer myself no , you're , you're gen x okay , okay , that's the archetype .
Speaker 2Pretty well , okay . Okay , where's the boomer cut off . At the 64 , I say with a person . Oh yeah , I'm solidly out of that group but uh , but either way , like I , she problem solves . And so I'll be like hey , brooke , we can't do this because of X reason . She'll sit there and think about it . She goes , yeah , but we could just do this and it'll work .
Speaker 1I'm like you're right , but I said no , she's exposing the inadequacies of your parenting skills .
Speaker 2Which is great . I mean , it's going to be great because as she grows up and goes into the world , I want her to be able to logic her way out of a problem . I also want her to logic her way through conversations with you know other kids , other adults , everybody , but right now , as my child , it's like kid yeah , just do what I asked you to do , please .
Speaker 1Yeah , it's awesome to see kids developing their own personalities and stuff , isn't it ? It's kind of like becoming their own person , and it's something you can really be proud of .
Speaker 2We were very adamant with all family we were like , and anybody who spent time around us . It was do not baby , talk my kid . Whatever you do , don't baby , because then they're learning a whole nother language . So we taught Brooke how to speak from an early age , and it started whenever she was much younger of hey , just point at what you want , like just point at it . And she did well with that , and that was one or younger maybe . She did great with that , learned how to walk around one . But I didn't realize , as we were teaching her how to speak , that I would also hear the inner workings of a three-year-old brain . I had no clue and so it's just okay , yeah .
Speaker 1Yeah , what a lovely rabbit hole to go down . Three-year-old .
Speaker 2As of right now , around our house , because my child has an unhealthy obsession with Spider-Man . Right now .
Speaker 1Ooh , I like that .
Speaker 2She is Spider-Man , my wife is Ghostie , which is the , I think , Gwen Stacy Spider-Man . The white girl in the white outfit .
Speaker 1Yeah , yeah .
Speaker 2And I'm the Green Goblin , so I'm always the Green Goblin .
Speaker 1Oh , you're the bad guy . Mm-hmm Dang , I'm okay with it too .
Speaker 2I lean into it , so it's like I'm doing my best . Impersonation of William Dafoe .
Speaker 1Oh man , I'm leaning into it . What a great actor . I just saw him in two different movies .
Speaker 2Man , he's good , he is phenomenal and I don't know how many packs of Marlboro Reds he smoked to get that voice , but I want it . It's like he was born to play the goblin , like that part was amazing . He did another role and it was a I mean a patently terrible movie , but he did phenomenal in it and it's called death note . Have you ever heard of it ?
Speaker 1so my daughter read the graphic novel , I believe , and she told me all about it . I didn't know that they made a movie about it actually made a movie .
Speaker 2I think it's on netflix and william defoe plays ryuk , who's's essentially the . He's not the villain , but he's like the spirit or entity that aids the main character . Not giving anything away , but anyway , william Dafoe , the first time he spoke as Ryuk I was like , oh , thank you , it just filled my soul .
Speaker 1And then I saw him in the Spider-man movie with tom holland and I'm like yes , did you actually read the graphic novel or did you come cold turkey into that movie ?
Speaker 2no , I watched the anime . Uh , I'm an anime nerd , okay , um . So I watched the anime , the original anime , and the original anime was so , so good , because you've got , um , uh , what is his name ? Light , I think is . The is the main character's name and then you got his counterpart , which works for the police department . They're playing this game of cat and mouse and it is so darn good .
Speaker 1I'm going to have to go watch it now .
Speaker 2It's great , especially the last couple .
Speaker 1Skip the movie , but see the animated . Yes , right , okay , just to be clear , the movie sucks .
Speaker 2Yeah , the movie was patently terrible . It's like they took a whole lot of creative liberties . I'm like just stick to the source material , that's all you have to do .
Speaker 1Right , everybody wants to make something their own . It's like we're only watching it because it's what we want it to be . We don't want to see your version of it , damn it .
Speaker 2Yeah , yeah .
Speaker 1I mean sure , if you're remaking it for the fifth time like , yeah , okay , let's make Batman have a different background , I'm cool with that . Like I've seen it 80 times , I get it . But a movie that's never come out , don't take creative liberties , man , Just make the source material .
Speaker 2Yeah , and they did that as well with Assassin's Creed , so that's another game I'm huge into , and if you're a Mason , you want to play Assassin's Creed Because it goes on there's a war between the assassins and the Templars . Yep , yes , yeah . But if you look at the game , which ?
Speaker 1is historically accurate . From what I understand , there actually was a bit of a thing between assassins and Templars .
Speaker 2I kind of so . I don't know about actual assassins , but whenever I read Born in Blood , my mindset on Assassin's Creed shifted a little bit , and so it was more like the Assassins were more like the Masons and the Knights Templars in the 1300s and the Templars were more like the Hospitallers and the Catholic Church .
Speaker 1Oh , okay .
Speaker 2That's where my mindset started to shift a little bit . But I'm going to go back and play them all again because I have no life , and kind of see if that matches up .
Speaker 1Well , I think that we should definitely do an episode on Born in Blood . It's a book I personally have brought in many , many , many people into the fraternity and it takes a while when you petition lodge till you get your internet apprentice degree and everybody's really excited and so divert . To divert them from going online and doing too much research . Yeah , because I tell them please don't do that , not for me , but for you , don't do it . Um , read this book instead . I think you'll find it really interesting .
Masonic Literature and Personal Journey
Speaker 1I always refer freemasonry for dummies because I think that's about the best primer you're going to give anybody about what freemasonry actually is . Yeah , and born in blood , because it's just amazing . What a great book and historically accurate I have freemasonry for dummies .
Speaker 2I don't think I've ever opened the book , but it's in my library , you know everything in it , so there's no reason for you to do it .
Speaker 1But for someone that's interested and hasn't joined yet , it's definitely . It scratches that itch you have about like , oh , I want to know everything .
Speaker 2Well , I also have morals and dogma , and I started to read morals and dogma because I haven't been through the Scottish right . I'm like I have no flipping clue what's going on right now . It's written in Old English so it's a little difficult to swallow .
Speaker 1That is basically about all of the degrees in the Scottish Rite , and the Scottish Rite degrees cover every bit of recorded human history in my opinion . So it's going to be dense . Like you said , it's Old English , these are thinking men and you know they don't know how to do punctuation . So right , we'll be reading one sentence for two pages like wait , where's , where's ?
Speaker 2the end of this .
Speaker 1It's like there's gonna be a turnoff somewhere I need the uh , I need the pop-up version of this book .
Speaker 2I'd rather look at pictures can you give me like the picture , like the picture Bible , like what I have for my kid ? It's like with a pop-up and like Noah's Ark flips up . Oh really , Can you give me that ? But like morals and dogma .
Speaker 1That would . Hey , I think you're onto something there . We might want to get busy on that and doctoring our children . I for children so enough of that , chris .
Speaker 1We need to get serious . People want to hear about freemasonry . All right , not about us , it's not about us . Well , um , you know , I think it's it's fair for us to talk about why we haven't been posting content . I'm under masonic charges . Uh , you know , our grandmaster put a ruined decision out about posting on social media and then he put me under charges for some stuff that I said prior to his ruling and decisions . So that's going to go to trial in March , march 1st . Okay .
Speaker 1So you know , because of that , I think we both decided , you know what let's not like , because anything I said was not meant to hurt anybody or be derogatory . It was 100 , just something that people say online . Um , and you know , I didn't want to put you or myself in a position because we talk a lot about freemasonry what if we said something wrong that someone could construe or view in a a different light than the way we meant it ? So better safe than sorry was the thinking there . For a while On my part I don't know about yourself we literally recorded content that we didn't release for fear that it could have been taken wrong .
Speaker 2And they were such fun episodes . I'm not going to say they were good , but they were fun .
Speaker 1What you remember of them right .
Speaker 2So for those who aren't aware , which , like , let's face it , like me , you and our wives are probably the only ones that know we did our first OTL after dark , oh yeah , where I got a little too far into the sauce .
Speaker 1I mean , there was no keeping it on track , I was really trying .
Speaker 2You gave it an honest effort .
Speaker 1Johnny walker had other plans it was great actually , and we should release that at some point in the future . How ?
Speaker 2about we record it again and I don't get three glasses deep while we're recording this love it , love it .
Speaker 1I mean we'll definitely record it again . We have so much content that we haven't released . I mean , we have interviews , we have stuff that we've done . Um , we haven't been able to publish it , like , like I just said , out of , uh , an abundance of caution more than anything else . But I think , uh , you and I were talking and we were like you know what ? I missed the show , let's do the show , like damn everything else . Like we'll be careful , as careful as you and I can be , which isn't very careful , uh , because we're honest people and you get real when you see us and when you speak with us .
Speaker 2Well , especially whenever you have two guys that are on uh uh external hormones yeah , I mean , you're on yours , I'm on TRT . I mean anything can happen at this point .
Speaker 1Anything can happen . We might get married , but can happen . We might get married by the minute this happens , ready to go , but that's you know , just for everyone to be aware . That is why and you know I think I'm past it , I don't know about you I'm aware that people are already going to trial . Multiple people have had their trials and they've been suspended . I fully expect to be suspended because you know who brought the charges against me and past history of what they've done with other people .
Speaker 2I had to testify in a trial , yeah .
Speaker 1I mean .
Speaker 2Here . I am a new-in Mason . I've only been a Mason for like what 14 months and I've already been through a charter pool and a trial .
Speaker 1That's what I want to get into . I want to talk about you . So we started our journey together on this podcast , with you talking about your journey in freemasonry . You were a fellow craft in the beginning . I don't know if you remember the first I didn't get you before but cooney introduced me . I think my lodge did your degree for you . I think it was your master mason degree , you're in .
Speaker 2So , yeah , you , you guys sent up 14 , 47 , sent up , I think , four brothers to help out in the master Mason degree . Um , cause I , as a fellow craft , you know the worst will . Master comes up to me and he's like dude , I can't find enough people for your master Mason degree . And I was like I'll make some calls Like yeah , and yeah , and you just pulled in the team .
Speaker 1We left off , talking about your Masonic career , what it's like to be a Mason . This podcast was always intended to be heard not just by Masons , but people that might be interested about Freemasonry and are doing some research . We wanted to provide content for them to answer questions they might have in their mind . And I think when you and I first spoke our very first conversation me I listen , I'm not , I'm not even a master mason yet , and I wanted feedback from you , honest feedback , and you gave it . You said I'd really like to hear somebody's journey because you weren't a mason yet . So you were obviously very interested in that content . Yeah , what am I getting into ? So here we are .
Freemasonry Lodge Dynamics and Protocol
Speaker 1Um , when we left off , you were the junior deacon of your lodge at Turkey Creek .
Speaker 2Oh Turkey Creek 248 .
Speaker 1Yes , the lodge formerly known as Turkey Creek 248 . Now you were junior deacon at Turkey Creek . What the heck happened . So , through a series of important events , you've got to give us the Cliff Notes version , obviously because we don't want to get too deep into the weeds on it the cliff notes version is that turkey creek 248 got its charter pulled um .
Speaker 2So , and you know , there's .
Speaker 1What I'm hearing is they had a lodge before you became a member and then you became a member and now that isn't a lodge anymore . I'm not saying that you're the reason , but there's definitely some causes , you know , interesting facts there I'm feeling it , to be honest with you .
Speaker 2Um so no , so you know I I worked over at turkey creek .
Speaker 1I put in a lot of work , a lot of effort over at turkey oh , I know you did and and it wasn't just me , you know , there were some other brothers who helped out as well , um , but I mean , you're building a nice team , nice team of people that were ready to , you know , improve things , move things forward over there .
Speaker 2We had at the at the October is whenever we got our charter pulled . We had at that point we would need one year of a past master and then we would have eight years of all fresh masters . So that's , that's where it left off and it just it wasn't able to survive the gauntlet , as it were . So , okay , no use crying over spilled milk . I will say I think it was early last year , about a year ago , I went and visited for the first time . I went and visited Lakeland Lodge 91 . And I went over to Lakeland Lodge and , man , the difference in masonry between districts blew my mind .
Speaker 2I mean it was night and day difference . So , for those curious , I was a member of a lodge here in District 20 , and I believe Lakeland is in District 21 , if I remember right . So I ended up going over to Lakeland . I visited them a couple of times . Their master at the time , uh , last year , was a , um , uh , a guy from bosnia , uh , jasmine gerbic . Gerbic gerbic . Jasmine is about six feet tall , I'd say about 240 , 250 of just solid , you know beard down to here the dude's got fire in his blood . I love him . What Jasmine had done with Lakeland is , if I'm hearing it right , lakeland was in a similar position to what Turkey Creek was in , but Jasmine yanked that thing up by the neck and turned it around . They were doing multiple lodge visits a year . All their degree work . They do in-house everything . He had a solid line to where , all the way down to the senior deacon , everybody was in the same mindset . So I was like Jasmine I'm thinking about doing a plural over at your lodge , you know , because I really like Lakeland .
Speaker 1This is when you were still at Turkey Creek .
Speaker 2Yeah , yeah and so , and even still midway through the year at Turkey Creek I think it was , oh gosh June , I think it was I got a battlefield promotion where I got swapped with the senior deacon and I then became senior deacon . Even on the Grand Lodge website I was acknowledged as senior deacon Best chair in the officer line .
Speaker 1Senior deacon .
Speaker 2Honestly , I really enjoyed it . Line senior deacon he taught me how to do balloting because I had messed up balloting at one point , because I'd never done it before . He taught me DDGM reception .
Speaker 2I mean and even still like whenever I saw him at the trial , I walked over , shook his hand , sat there and talked to him for an hour and I said hey , man , I just want to thank you because now we're doing training over at Lakeland and I'm taking some of the stuff that you taught me and taking it over there to those guys and some of the stuff they do know , some of the stuff they don't know .
Speaker 1Right , that's the thing People outside of Freemasonry just assume . We all are born knowing how to do all the secret ritual stuff .
Speaker 2Oh Lord no .
Speaker 1But we're not . We have to be taught and what happens is you're taught by the people in the lodge you go to generally . And those people , it becomes suspect how they learned it . They might have learned it from somebody else that was in their lodge and that guy learned it from somebody else that was in their lodge and , uh , it's not an unbroken chain of the actual work as recorded and documented right versus what people do in lodges .
Speaker 1I learned that early on , um , because , like you , I was doing degree . I was made a fellow craft and the next day I was in a fellow craft to grade a different lot . And so I'm standing in their lodge and they're teaching me how to do floor work as a steward , and the way they turn and sit in their chairs is completely different than the way it was in my lodge , and so I learned early on . Anytime you go to a different lodge to do work , you should always ask them is this how you do it , or watch how I do it ? And make sure you guys are okay with this , because they may not follow the work as it's supposed to be done . They might have their own localized way to do it and people get a little offended if you don't do it their way , which is one of the things that always boggled my mind about the fraternity , because there's only one right way , but I think there's about 80 different ways to do the ritual .
Speaker 2So I'm going to kick a hornet's nest real quick for all of our listeners and I want to hear everybody's opinion on this Everyone . So I learned how to be senior deacon , and flag ceremony is open to the public right , so I'm not violating anything right now .
Speaker 1So when Dave taught me how to do the flag ceremony , it's left arm at 90 degrees , holding the staff hand on the bottom the pole slightly leaning forward , and the flag has to be free and aloft . So the work specifically says 45 degree angle right .
Speaker 2Here's the thing , though . That's not flag conduct , right ? We've got two military guys on our line , and so I asked our our di over in district 21 , or a former di , uh , right , honorable , um . I said , hey , I have a question about the flag . And he goes don't you dare ? And I'm like , I'm like it's just a question , I just simple question . Come on , man . And so the way our military guys do it in our lodge and actually I saw them doing down in 14 too is they hold the flag straight up and down .
Speaker 1Yeah .
Speaker 2And because that's the way you're supposed to carry the flag .
Speaker 1Well , they carry it at a 45 , but when people are actually giving the Pledge of Allegiance , they hold it straight up .
Speaker 2So how we do it and this goes to the nuance that you talked about is our military guys over at Lakeland 91 , they refuse to let the flag bow to anybody . It is straight up and down .
Speaker 1Oh okay , that's clearly not correct according to Florida work .
Speaker 2Right , but what supersedes what ? Is it military flag , code of conduct , or is it Masonic floor work ?
Speaker 1You're asking the wrong guy because I tend to follow civil law and the constitutional law , but there's Masonic law , which is a little different Right , apparently , depending on who's in charge .
Speaker 2Well , luckily our DI's over there , they don't have a problem with it .
Speaker 1Yeah , and that's the thing . Locally generally , even , like you said , in a district , they kind of all agree on yeah , we all like it this way better . You know that's how they do it .
Speaker 2So , but the only thing our senior deacon does and , Armando , I love you to death the only thing our senior deacon does is this was kind of and I think we're getting together for a practice tomorrow night , so I'll probably bring it up tomorrow night is when he turns . Dave made a very particular point that always stuck in my head when you turn as a senior deacon , you , when you turn as a senior deacon , you never turn away from the worshipful master , you always turn towards the worshipful master .
Speaker 2So and I've seen Armando do it a couple of times during the flag ceremony where , like , he turns the opposite direction and I'm just like I don't know what the right answer is there- I'm sure the answer to that is in the book , because that kind of floor work is pretty clearly explained . Yeah . In the actual floor work book but I will say like to his credit like armando got thrown in as senior deacon and he is killing it as senior deacon like you .
Speaker 2Show him once he's got it that's awesome I , I love that dude to death man and he's , um , he's cuban , uh , and I say that because his personality type is hilarious whenever we're like , oh know , we have a thought of going and getting X thing for the lodge . Okay , uh , so when are we going to do it ? We're going to do it next week . Okay , what are you doing right now ? Can we do it right now ? Come on Like let's get the .
Speaker 1I love that . Yeah , dude , Pedal to the metal . I love .
Speaker 2That's what we
Changing Lodges
Speaker 2need . So back to the point of you know , we , we , I'm at Turkey Creek , I get the battlefield promotion , the senior Deacon , we have a DDGM reception , we have a grandmaster reception . I had to learn a little bit on the grandmaster reception , cause I didn't realize if the grand Marshall was there . It kind of changes the dynamics a little bit of who escorts the grand , the grandmaster , to the East . So I learned that the hard way . Um , but uh , but yeah . So I , I go over to lakeland and they're they asked me , you know they're like , hey , why are you wanting to join over at lakeland ? And I was like , well , I'm kind of homeless , like will you take in a poor and wandering soul ?
Speaker 1So this is after your charter was pulled . Now I'm curious about that because I've never actually experienced that . How much notice did you get ? Or do they just pull it and you can't go back to like , do they notify it ? Like , how do you know what to do or when to do it ? Like , what is that process like ?
Speaker 2So we had no idea that the grandmaster was going to be there that night . We had no clue until he walked in and he didn't even show up for dinner . He just showed up like I think 10 or 15 minutes before Lodge started and had like a whole entourage of people that came with him . So we were like Okay .
Speaker 1So he came to a stated meeting and left with your charter , correct ? And that was that . Yep , no , you couldn't ever get back in the lodge after that day .
Speaker 2No , as a matter of fact , I was told by the DD , who's a great guy . I mean , he's in a tough situation . Yeah , I'm sure , and I love debating him . Oh , it's my favorite thing to debate that guy , you know , because he doesn't take it personal , and neither do I . It's just like , all right , these are the facts we're dealing with . All right , let's talk about it .
Speaker 1And we all know you're a master debater .
Speaker 2Yes , I have been ever since the ripe old age of 13 . So , having said that , had to take it there , didn't you , chris ?
Speaker 1Actually , it's grammatically correct .
Speaker 2I don't know what you heard when I said it , so either way , um , yeah , he shows up , he's got everybody with him . Um , we had no idea that it was going to happen that night and I think our lodge meeting from the time the grandmaster started until the close of lodge . I think it was an hour and a half , so that was a late night . Um , I think we were there until like 11 , 11 , 30 , something like that . Um , and whenever they take the screwdriver and pull the charter off the wall , man , you can hear a pin drop oh , I bet uh , and of course , me being me , I'm sitting there cracking jokes , you know , left and right .
Speaker 2And so our dd roscoe , he's got these like half moon glasses and he just like one of those stairs , like you know , like he's like now it's not the time .
Speaker 1Now's not the time . I don't care .
Speaker 2Like my charter's pulled . Ok , you all put your pants on the same way I do . Let's have some fun with this .
Speaker 1So we have a recorded episode that goes into great detail about this that we can't release , so it's good to get that out there . Your lodge charter was pulled and you had some great information that we had planned to release about , like , how to recover your lodge . You had a checklist of steps , um , and a plan that I think was meant to be a three-year plan that you turned into like an eight-year plan or something yeah , we had eight to eleven years years of everything planned out and I still have that .
Speaker 1Yeah , so I think we should still release that , even though it didn't work . I don't think it didn't work because of your lodge or the brothers Clearly there was other stuff going on there , yeah but I think that's valuable information for other people that might be in a lodge , not just like whose charter is in danger , but just a struggling lodge .
Speaker 2You know , that's maybe and I want to be fair about this . Um and and I think this is a fair thing to say being over at lakeland and seeing a the mindset of masonry over there and then the mindset of lakeland , I see why the grandmaster did what he did . I get it , I understand it . I'm not in total agreement with how it was done and I have data points on that , a lot of data points on that . I have a five-page letter of rebuttal with dates , quotes , everything . So I have a five-page letter of rebuttal ready to go to jurisprudence .
Speaker 1Well , don't do anything with that for the next four months , please . Yeah , I was going to say let's , I like loving you around .
Speaker 2After May shall we ?
Speaker 1Only one of us can be suspended .
Speaker 2So either way , again , I see why he did it . I love the people over at Turkey Creek . I really do . I still keep in contact with a lot of them . Matter of fact , I yeah , I actually met up with one the other day . We went and got a drink . You know just . You know , that was just what , what ?
Speaker 1That was going to be one of my questions , like , do you , do you guys ever get together , or do you just kind of say , oh , that's in my past now and look , look to the future .
Speaker 2Not as a lodge , we don't get together . But you know I still hang out with them individually and , as a matter of fact , four of the brothers over at Turkey Creek are now aside from me . Four of the brothers are coming over to Lakeland as well .
Speaker 1Okay , Okay , yeah . Did the other brothers go to just other lodges closer to them , or are they like out ?
Speaker 2They went to where they knew the most people .
Speaker 1Okay .
Speaker 2So a couple of the guys went down to DeSoto , which is down in Riverview . Some of the guys went to AW Windhorse , tampa 240 picked up a couple , dade City picked up a handful . So they just went to where they knew people .
Speaker 1What an interesting start to your Masonic career . I know you started as a junior deacon , you moved up to senior deacon , your charter's pulled . Now you're at a new lodge around a new group of people , and what happens ?
Speaker 2So I was invited to a lodge officer's meeting and this was , I think , the first telltale sign that I had made a good choice with Lakeland . I go to a lodge officer's meeting and I don't know how it is at 147 or anywhere else in the state , but when we had a lodge officer's meeting at Turkey Creek , you struggled just to get the officers to show up . Yeah , that was a true statement .
Speaker 1Yeah .
Speaker 2We had a lodge officers meeting at Lakeland 91 and not only did the entire line show up , but like five additional people showed up . Wow , it was insane . We had like almost 15 people sitting in the cafeteria saying what are we doing for 2025 ?
Speaker 1So I saw that that was an issue for years .
Revitalizing a Masonic Lodge
Speaker 1Officers don't show up to the officers meeting , yeah , and they just get a pass . So when I had an opportunity to start holding officers meeting as the master , I took . You know , I own a business . I take copious notes of everything I do because I have a horrible memory . So I took copious notes of every meeting and sent it to everybody . The whole lodge saw who attended our officer's meeting and who did not attend our officer's meeting . How long do you think it took before everybody was there attending the officer's meeting ?
Speaker 2I'm sure they were at the next one .
Speaker 1Yeah , next one . And then you get the visitors . You get the people . That are people that are like oh wow , there's some cool stuff going on . Maybe I should show up because anyone can give their opinion on something and , you know , maybe take a project or make suggestions , so that kind of momentum starts to build . I think that momentum solves a lot of problems in lodges . So once you get that going , um , things get really well and it sounds like Lakeland is in a better place than Turkey Creek was on the momentum side .
Speaker 2Oh dude , it is insane , the night and day difference . So they were going to have . They had a guy who wanted to be the junior deacon . He was a senior steward the year before and he was supposed to have been junior deacon that year . So he ends up having a baby move , career change , life gets in the way , I get it , I understand it . And so he's like hey , by the way , I'm really excited to move up to senior deacon .
Speaker 2And they're like you've not shown up for junior deacon , much less senior deacon . So you know , they encouraged him and they were like hey , if you , if you come back I think this is late last year they're like , hey , if you come back , then all right , you're , you're going through the senior deacon . And I told them I was like guys , look , I've got my mlt's done . I've got master mason one , two , three done . I've already started lodge officer training course . Um , you know . So if you need me , I'm here , but don't think I'm chasing chairs , I'm not I . I just realized that it's kind of difficult to get people to show up yeah you know .
Speaker 2So if you need me , I'm here . And then they ended up installing me as junior deacon this year , so now I'm the junior deacon at Lakeland . Back to junior deacon . Back to junior deacon and junior deacon's fun .
Speaker 1It can be fun there's . You know , you're over there pretty far away from everybody , and you got one person that you can banter with and most people won't hear you no , we've got two two because our our worshipful master .
Speaker 2Last year , jasmine came back as our marshal and he has been at every meeting as our marshal that's .
Speaker 1That's rare . I don't often see marshall showing up to the meetings .
Speaker 2Yeah that's great . So we're talking about momentum . That's one thing jasmine said . He and I were at a grotto event and we sat down , ate , had a drink and he was like look , you got to understand . Everybody in our line over at Lakeland , they all have the same mindset . You and I do . Protect the Westgate at all costs , right , protect the Westgate , push this lodge forward , push it forward , push the bounds , push all of it . But we need to be an active lodge and we've got to grow this lodge because at the end of the day , it's not our lodge , it's the next generation's lodge .
Speaker 1Right .
Speaker 2And we have to do that .
Speaker 1For them . Yeah , and that's where you were at . At the other lodge you clearly have a generation before . You didn't care or weren't effective at . You know the things they were trying to do because you could see , and a lot of lodges are like that People come into it and it's run down . There's just a general sense that no one cares anymore .
Speaker 2Yeah .
Speaker 1And .
Speaker 2I didn't feel that over at Lakeland and now even as a as junior deacon , it's energizing right .
Speaker 1Just to walk into a building with that kind of energy in it .
Speaker 2It is so . I mean we're , we're putting together like a proposal right now , where but we're going to ? And here's the frustrating thing is , our meetings are always packed Like when . I say packed , I'm talking like the agenda is packed .
Speaker 2So it's like we're not just going in going over minutes . All right , do you have anything else to bring Right ? You know we're not doing that . It is no . Here's what we're doing . We've got this practice , we've got this degree . We've got this fundraiser , we've got . You know , who are we giving our money to for this thing ? I mean it's , it is such an active lodge . Matter of fact , yesterday we had to travel in Gavel for almost a year for that district and so Travelers Lodge came in and got it a couple of meetings ago . So it's like , alright , you guys got it . Yeah , cool . So we send them off with the Traveler's Gavel or the Traveling Gavel Then . And Traveler's Lodge is out in Lake Alfred , so it's like probably 20-30 minutes from our lodge . They meet on Saturday mornings at 8 am .
Speaker 1You want to know what I didn't want to do . It's a daylight lodge .
Speaker 2What's that ?
Speaker 1It's a daylight lodge .
Speaker 2It's a daylight lodge .
Speaker 1Oh .
Speaker 2You want to know what I didn't want to do . Saturday morning at 10 am or 8 am , get up and drive all the way to Lake Alfred , which is a 45-minute drive for me , in order to get the traveling gavel . But that's what we did . So we get in there . We sit through their meeting . Uh , worshipful Ryan , uh , ryan Griner , love that guy . Um , ryan stands up and he goes hey , uh want to know how partial you are to that traveling gavel . Everybody starts laughing . Why is everybody laughing ? They ?
Speaker 1share a building with Hain City Lodge .
Speaker 2And Hain City took the gavel . Even though it sits in that room , it's Hain City's gavel .
Speaker 1So there was literally no reason for you to be there .
Speaker 2And Hain City meets on the exact same nights that we meet . So we were like , oh , talk about a Masonic bait and switch man , that was good . Wow , like oh , talk about a Masonic bait and switch man . That was good , wow .
Speaker 1So you got to meet some new brothers , you got to see a new lodge . You know that's fun , right ?
Speaker 2It is . It is so fun and I love where Lakeland is headed . You know we're talking about updating the lights , updating the library and , by the way , Lakeland Lodge is not a small lodge . It's a 9,000 square foot building . It is not a tiny lodge .
Speaker 1Wow , that's pretty big , the whole building's 9,000 square feet . Is it two stories or one One ?
Speaker 2Okay , yeah , it has an eastern star that meets in there . The back rooms aren't being used right now , except for storage for other lodges that had closed down over the years .
Speaker 1I aren't being used right now , except for like storage for other lodges that had that had closed down over the years .
Speaker 2I , I see a game room in your future . There's a pool table back there , yeah , yeah . So , uh , you know , we , we have a , we have an offer . Somebody's trying to buy our lodge because they're trying to buy the entire block . Yeah , um , you know , because it's right in downtown lakeland , I mean , it's prime real estate . So those conversations are happening and I tell you what it's being part of a line and our entire line . By the way , the oldest person is 52 years old .
Speaker 1Wow .
Speaker 2That's the oldest person and he looks like a 25-year-old . Neff , I'm sorry but you do , but he's 52 .
Speaker 1That's a compliment to a 52-year-old .
Speaker 2Don't say sorry , dude , I I'm telling you , man , like you know , the hispanic genes are strong like his . His name's nef and uh , and nef is just like one of the most laid back , chilled out , nicest guys . He's our junior warden right now makes phenomenal dinners for us . I mean , like I think last time we had homemade fried chicken and mashed potatoes oh , yes , please yeah , no more green beans at this lodge , so uh you're junior deacon , you're .
Speaker 1You're now . I mean you were installed a couple about a month ago , right ?
Speaker 2yeah , yeah , right out a month ago , because I think our , I think our installation was the fourth . So , yeah , right out a month . So how long have you been a mason now ?
Speaker 114 months . 14 months you've been an officer in two lodges . You've been present at a charter poll . You were in a masonic trial I was in a trial .
Speaker 2I was what the heck man .
Speaker 114 months , it was like forever in your masonic career . So I don't know if you
Masonic Trial and Lodge Etiquette
Speaker 1. I'll preface the question by saying be aware that , um , when a grandmaster doesn't like something , you say he can suspend you from freemasonry . So , that being said , why were you part of , why were you part of this masonic tribe ?
Speaker 2so so , basically what it boils down to is I'm a york right mason . I'm a grotto member , I've been a part of two lodges . Now I'm trying to speed run . Masonry Is what I'm trying to do . I should have waited until you took your drink before I said that .
Speaker 1It came out my nose , it tastes even better .
Speaker 2So yeah , the trial , the trial Was interesting . I don't know how Masonic trials go .
Speaker 1You're not the main star of this right .
Speaker 2No , no , no , I was the witness .
Speaker 1You were a witness for the person that was on trial , or you were a witness against the person .
Speaker 2I ended up testifying for both sides . Oh , you flip-flopped . I didn't flip-flop , I told the truth , okay okay . So , as I was telling the truth it was I was set to testify for the prosecution and then for the guy being prosecuted .
Speaker 1He was like , hey , I'm also calling him as a witness for me , and they were like okay so do you get called in two separate times , or did they just kind of knock it all out while you're in there ?
Speaker 2no , they did it all in one batch , so he got his questions out of the way and then , uh , the chairman , uh , and the the board ended up asking questions . But at the end of the day , with that trial , that trial was weird . Here's what I said in the trial and this is the honest truth . I mean and I don't think this is a controversial point at all , for the situation that was involved , a situation happened between them two and that's what sparked the charges . Both of those brothers were factually correct in what they said .
Speaker 2What they said was right and accurate , but they both handled it very poorly , and that's what happened . And so it was just . You know . Everybody knows how it is in Lodge every now and then , where it's like all right , tempers start to flare , it's . You know , we're going over a very difficult topic and so something happens there's a disagreement , and then boom , and so both of them were factually correct in what they said , but both handled it poorly I have no idea who was the person being prosecuted and who was the person that brought the charges .
Speaker 1However , you just told me there was a past master and a district deputy of our grandmaster , so I can assume already that if the grandmaster's district deputy was involved , he was not the person probably on trial . No , and it probably didn't go well for the person that was on trial .
Speaker 2Well , I mean he only got a six month suspension . Ok , I mean , I've heard some people say that it's justified . I've heard some people say that he should have just got a reprimand , like a verbal reprimand . I'm not in any sort of position to make any decision about that because I'm still a new Mason .
Speaker 1I still care , 14 months in .
Speaker 2It's like sink or swim , Matt , here you go . I'm not in a position to say what was justified , what was not justified . I just went in there , told the truth , called it down the middle .
Speaker 1What I did hear you say is that both people seem like maybe they could have handled it better , but only one is now suspended .
Speaker 2So , yes , so here's the thing , and I would encourage all of our brothers on this . So we have a handful of working tools that we talk about ?
Speaker 1Is it the shotgun or the nine millimeter ?
Speaker 2Oh , that's on my hip , Uh we're talking about the same working tools right . Yeah , sure , okay , um , so either way , um , and I would encourage all of our brothers on this when you're in lodge or you're even , you're , you're even talking to a brother , it doesn't matter . You're supposed to use a handful of our working tools and you're supposed to whisper wise counsel to a brother , and you're supposed to use the trowel , and and and all these things .
Speaker 2And conduct yourself with a certain level of decorum to respect the lodge Right , you know not only that decorum , to respect the lodge right you know not only that , but respect the craft , respect we belong to right , and I saw none of those lessons or tools being used that night . None of them . And and that was kind of the big takeaway from that yeah , it's a generational thing .
Speaker 1It's probably somebody of a different generation that doesn't get the joke . You know , I've seen that because I I like to make people laugh too . Yeah , it's kind of . For me it's a defense mechanism . If I'm nervous I just try to make people laugh . I've had multiple situations where I was an officer in a lodge , in a tiled meeting that was open and I said something that made people laugh and an old guy didn't hear it or didn't understand it and got upset . At the end of the day I always say I'm sorry , that was inappropriate to me . I , I made a joke , I apologized and I shouldn't have done that . You know so because technically I wasn't . You know you are in the wrong . We're not supposed to be making light and having fun .
Speaker 2Well well , no , I disagree with the making light and having fun , because I've been a part of some meetings where it's like it , it was hilarious , like , and I even had one I had one as junior deacon where it's like just a couple of weeks ago where , like my Tyler got locked out of the building . He went to go put something in his car and got locked out of the building . So it's like oh no door and there's nobody there .
Speaker 1Oh no . And so then I get asked afterwards and they were like you know who and I'm like I don't know I mean he's hardcore tiling , not just tiling the inner door , he's tiling from outside the building making sure nobody's getting in .
Speaker 2That's hardcore checking the eaves man .
Speaker 1He's checking the eavesdroppers he's pacing around the building while the meeting's taking place .
Speaker 2That's great , so I mean , we have those moments where you know we laugh and cut up . But no , back to the brother that I offended and we've never had any issues since , by the way . So either way , it's like you know he I said something about flying circus monkeys and he goes . Well , I'll leave my derogatory comments about you to myself . And I'm like what are you going to call me the dollar store , mr Clean ? Like what do you got ? I'm bald for those listening on audio . I'm like what do you got ? You're not going to offend me . And then I lean over to Jasmine afterward , because he went and sat on the north side . I lean over to Jasmine and I was like , hey , jasmine , did I actually offend that guy ? And he goes yeah , brother , I think you did .
Speaker 2And I was like that was a low ball joke . So I walked over and I said hey brother , did I offend you by what ? By my joke , by what I said ? And he's like yes , I , you know he's older . Yes , I was very offended by what you said . I'm like oh well , I apologize , I was in the wrong . I did not mean to cause offense , it was just a lowball joke . So I apologize for causing offense . I shouldn't have done it .
Speaker 2I was very offended and I went okay , so I've now apologized . It is up to you if you want to take that or not . Right , but I apologize for my words and I will not make them again . And he gets , he shakes my hand and he goes all right , it's water under the bridge .
Speaker 1It's like there you go , that's good . Yeah , I mean , we are , uh , in a fraternity where no one's getting paid to be there . At least , very few people are getting paid to be there . In my lodge , the secretary actually does get paid .
Speaker 2Oh nice .
Speaker 1Yeah , so , but most of us aren't getting paid and you know you're there because you love it really . I mean , that's the only reason most of us are there . We believe in the fraternity and its virtues . So , you know , you got people that are very passionate about something and they're there on their yeah , yeah . Then the free time away from their family , away from their work it's really easy to offend people in that environment . Yeah , it is really easy .
Speaker 2Um , and especially with the generational differences yes , yes , I mean between generations .
Speaker 2People get offended on different levels . I mean , if you're dealing with and this is what I've seen if you're dealing with , um , I'd say in the lodge , I'd say like 20 of the older brothers that are in the lodge much older brothers , and they're retired . You know they're doing this because they love it . They've been in it for 30 , 40 , 50 years . You know , like 20 of the brothers like you breathe the wrong direction and they get offended . But you also have the vice versa and this is why I encourage everyone to read that book , the fourth turning .
Speaker 2You also have the vice versa and this is why I encourage everyone to read that book , the fourth turning . You also get the opposite side of that , which are they're more like the gray wardens and they're more like the guides and the mentors and stuff like that . And then you get a gen X like yourself . I could throw some pretty raunchy stuff your way and you're going to throw it right back at me and we're just going to laugh it off . We're like millennial . Millennials have some of the darkest senses of humor at all out of everybody I've met and I'd say the jokes are hilarious . I love them .
Speaker 1You aren't a millennial .
Speaker 2I am a millennial .
Speaker 1Okay , that's what I thought . Yeah , I mean , there's not a lot of millennials in the lodges . We need more .
Speaker 2Yeah , and that's what's so nice about our line , except for one person . In our line , everybody on the floor is a millennial , except for the marshal , the senior steward and the junior warden . But everybody else is a millennial and we're all business owners . We're all like I'm not going to say we're type A mentality , but we're all like go-getters , yeah , yeah , like pushing everything forward , like all of us are that way .
Speaker 1That's awesome . You're going to have a great time going through the chairs in that lodge . Yeah , like you'll definitely butt heads with a couple people , but those that's all part of the learning experience in my , in my opinion , you're you're supposed to have those issues , and your failures will help you be a better master and help you .
Speaker 2Help you be a master to other people that are just having their first you know issue because you've been there and you know how it is and you know , we we had that recently where , uh , worshipful ryan , he is so much further down the road than me with conflict resolution because he had a past master jump his crap during a meeting one night and he sat there and he took it and he's like thank you for your words and I'm like I would have unalived that guy in a heartbeat , like are you kidding me ? Yeah so , and I told him afterwards . I walk up after the meeting . I shook his hand and I said I have a lot to learn from you . He's younger than I am and I have a lot to learn from you because how you just handled that brother was the right way to do it . And I am not there yet .
Speaker 1Yeah , yeah , you want to get back at that guy slowly and painfully over time . Not right then , on the spot , come on
Navigating Masonic Camaraderie and Politics
Speaker 1.
Speaker 2Now we're talking .
Speaker 1Now it's a party that's how my generation handles their business . Yeah exactly .
Speaker 2There's no pettiness like Masonic pettiness .
Speaker 1My wife says that all the time . She's like for a bunch of dudes .
Speaker 2You guys have a lot of drama . Yeah , yeah , and I told my wife this earlier today . You know , before you and I called before you and I talked on the phone . Uh , I was talking to another brother out of state and I was like , man , there is no drama like masonic drama .
Speaker 1And she's like why I'm like we've now got like four states wrapped up in this conversation yeah , but you know , uh , one thing my wife understands is how , you know , I don't go to church necessarily . This is kind of the thing that fills that part of my spiritual life . Okay , you know , freemasonry does that for me . So , the tenets of the fraternity , the history , the ritual work , that's why I have a gold card and a brown card and a purple card , nice , I'm in all the appended bodies right , and I do as much lecturing as I can because I want to always learn and I'm fascinated by the fraternity . Um , and I think that's something that we we have , we should fall back on when we get into that , like caught up in the stupid human drama , which is inevitable , doesn't matter what you're gonna have , human drama , which is inevitable , it doesn't matter what lodge you're in , you're going to have human drama .
Speaker 2Yeah , 100% , sooner or later .
Speaker 1And you know , especially if you go outside your lodge and you start to get into being a district committeeman after you're a past master , you might want to become a district deputy grandmaster . No , you might want to get involved at the state level , at a zone level , and let me tell you , the higher you go , the more drama there is , and I don't know that you're learning any more about Freemasonry or the tenets of our fraternity by going up the chain in Freemasonry . I think the closer you stay to your home lodge and the more dedicated you are to studying the work , the better the Freemasonry is going to impact your life in a much more profound way than getting into the bureaucracy of it . I mean , that's just me and I think some people love the bureaucracy . I mean , my mentor , one of my mentors , was a guy who was like a master at the bureaucracy of Freemasonry and I was always in awe at how he was able to handle it .
Speaker 2Um , but he hated ritual work see , and that's the thing is I actually really enjoy ritual work , yeah , but I don't have time for the politics right , and that's why yeah right .
Speaker 2So and even still I told , uh , you know the DD for District 20 , right where I was , from Roscoe . I said , look , anywhere you have a group of guys or people in general together , you're going to have a political nature to it . I mean , you got different personality types and you know work backgrounds and family backgrounds and even regionally here in the United States you get a guy from the Northeast that comes down here to Florida . He's not going to mesh well with the people in Florida . We just do crap different . So either way , I told him I said look , whenever it comes to the high end of masonry , whenever it comes to sometimes even at the local lodge .
Speaker 1Are you talking about , like higher level positions in the fraternity ?
Speaker 2Yeah , I'm talking , like you know like you know , grand lodge level stuff like that , um it's I . I struggle with being able to separate it or distinguish it from regular american politics or right , it's , it's . It doesn't look very different to me , it looks exactly the same , whereas at the local lodge level and I love the local lodge level and I- love the local lodge level .
Speaker 2It's fraternal . Yeah , we're studying tomorrow night . I got to study for an EA degree and I think yeah , so I'm going to be chaplain for the EA degree , even though I'm practicing for senior warden , because we had an empty chair . So the DI was like hey , sit over there . And I was like , say less so , but either way , are ?
Speaker 1you trying to learn ? Are you trying to memorize some of that stuff ?
Speaker 2Yeah , yeah . So here's the thing Whenever we were at Turkey Creek , we were about to put on an EA degree for three candidates and I was studying to sit in the East for the EA degree and , uh , the only the only thing I had left to memorize was the writing ceremony . That was that was it Uh ?
Speaker 2yeah . So I was studying to sit in the East for an EA degree . So I told him like guys like I want to help in degrees and like the stewards we have over there are like they've been stewards for years . They I swear they share the same brain as stewards . They are so good like their movements , steps , everything like they step with the same feet and one of them is like five foot six and the other one's six foot four . So make that make sense .
Speaker 1So , but when you see like uh , the work synchronized , like that it's just so good it's so much better it's so much better yeah , when you see the guys who are like jerky and like you first or me first , it's like oh , come on , guys , get your crap together well , I always .
Speaker 2I always take it as because , uh , the junior steward had to leave , so I just follow whatever the senior steward does . It's like no , you're , you're leading this right .
Speaker 1And I'm your senior .
Speaker 2So there's a pecking order and I need to respect that pecking order .
Speaker 1There are moments where the junior steward is in front and therefore he's technically leading the other one , but for the most part I would agree . And if you're just talking about the officer chairs , the junior steward is supposed to be learning from the senior steward and senior steward is supposed to be learning his junior deacon . Spot for next year .
Speaker 2And even still , that's something that has been a vast shift from Turkey Creek to Lakeland is . You know , for example , our building committee over at Lakeland ? I'm a general contractor . I've spent my entire life in the trades . You know I did my first new construction job at 12 years old .
Speaker 1Don't you also do AC .
Speaker 2Yeah , yeah , I do both .
Speaker 1Two different companies , same company Yep .
Speaker 2Two different companies .
Speaker 1So you run in two companies .
Speaker 2I have two jobs . Aha , so I have two jobs . But either way , and here's my mindset behind it , especially having having two jobs , is essentially I want to build an empire to be able to hand off to the next generation . Like this company is not mine , this company belongs to the next generation . I need to build it as high as I possibly can to hand it off to them .
Speaker 2You know , so you know , and that could be my daughter , my nieces and nephews . It could be anybody , any future kids my wife and I may have . No , this belongs to you . I'm just building it for you and reaping the benefits , but that also includes Disney cruises and all this other stuff that I don't want to do . Having said all that , yeah , so the building committee over at lakeland , at turkey creek , the senior warden was the head of the building committee , but he was not good at that role , so whenever it came to work being done at turkey creek , it was just me doing it there at the lodge by myself yeah , I called one time and you were like installing toilets or something .
Speaker 2Yeah , I was swapping out two toilets for ada compliant toilets , yeah , which there was nothing ada compliant about that entire building , so I don't know why we even bothered . Um , and they were gross , like anybody who's replaced toilets , and you get that wax ring down at the bottom of it . This was like a solid 1975 wax ring . It was so bad I had to level everything . I spent two days replacing toilets , just because of everything around them .
Speaker 1That's how much you love this fraternity .
Speaker 2So either way , the difference being is that over at Lakeland the senior warden's the head of the building committee . He's probably not the best from a knowledge standpoint of building , but I told the Worshipful Master I'm like hey , put me on there with him .
Speaker 2Right the worstful master . I'm like , hey , put me on , put me on there with him , right , and so everything I bring to the senior warden , it's like , look again , there's a hierarchy and a level of respect . I realize that I'm competent in what I do . You're the senior warden . I'm going to hand you all this information . You present it as your idea because you're the head of the committee right like , and that's the way I I believe that it should be I .
Speaker 1I think that's correct and accurate , and then he is obviously going to give you credit when the time comes . He may even say this is your idea , but ultimately he needs to be the one presenting it because it's his committee . I agree with that . So you're now installed as the junior deacon once again .
Speaker 2And do you feel like you're going to get to sit in all the chairs in this lodge as you progress through the line , barring external circumstances ? Yes , most likely .
Speaker 1Yeah , I mean you know , it always happens . Somebody moves away . There are things you can't predict , right . Somebody dies Things happen .
Speaker 2Well , and even still , we've even talked about it because we have such a young line . Our past master from last year sat plans in motion to where , whenever and he literally said this he goes by the time matt sits in the east . This will be at this point and ryan , our current , works for master . He goes by the time because , you know , by the time matt sits in the east , this will be the way things are . What I like about all the guys in the line is we're having conversation of okay , you're up next , what do you want to do so I can lay the groundwork for for you ? Great , like , what do you need so that way I can get it done ?
Speaker 2None of it's contentious at all . I mean , I think I've only seen two . I've only seen two conflicts the entire time I've been there and even still , like they weren't even conflicts in terms of how I saw it at Turkey Creek , it's just like , hey , we have this . Yeah , well , I brought this up five years ago . Great , then you can work with that guy while he's doing it , since it was your idea originally , and y'all guys can just knock it out of the park .
District Differences and Masonic Role Progression
Speaker 2You know , and it's so interesting to see the difference not only in lodges , but the difference in districts .
Speaker 2You know , like again we're putting on this EA degree . We've got like four lodges that are showing up in Lakeland and we're all practicing for this EA degree that we're going to be putting on in two weeks . Actually , we're going to be putting on an EA degree that I'm going to be the chaplain for .
Speaker 1And you've never been chaplain before .
Speaker 2No , no , it's my first time .
Speaker 1Cha before . No , no , it's my first time . Chaplain's fun . Yeah , uh , you don't have a lot of stuff to do , which why I think it's fun .
Speaker 2Don't get damaged .
Speaker 2And even still , I mean just looking at it from like even respecting of the past master's perspective um you know because I'm gonna sing the praises of lakeland 91 forever because , like you know , jasmine got out of the east . And whenever jasmine got out of the east it was so funny . The first time he called me like Heather and I are right . My wife and I are riding in the truck and the name Jasmine comes up across the phone and then she just like snaps and looks at me . She's like who's Jasmine ? I was like first off call me Aladdin . So either way , no Jasmine call . So either way call , or so either way , jasmine gets out of the east , we got him this beautiful custom-made past master's apron , oh nice , you know that , like nobody else in our district has .
Speaker 2Uh , we're talking about doing medals , um , because , uh , travelers lodge does that . I have a picture I'll send to you later . Um , but they do medals like past masters , medals that you can actually put on your jacket yes , I have one .
Speaker 1Yes , it's a military medal .
Speaker 2It's got like the ribbon with the square at the bottom .
Speaker 1Yeah .
Speaker 2So , either way , we're talking about doing that just to respect our past masters .
Speaker 1And it's like See mine's hanging on the wall over there next ?
Speaker 2Yeah , I see it . Next to the thing , yeah .
Speaker 1Just above the apron .
Speaker 2Nice . So it's like you know just little things like that is just completely different than anything that I have ever experienced before in masonry , and these past masters are all coming back Like the majority of our lodge . Whenever we fill up a lodge for a lodge night , it's majority past masters .
Speaker 1That's awesome .
Speaker 2Yeah , and we got a couple of guys that have never went through the chairs , but they've been in it for 20 years .
Speaker 1Really .
Speaker 2Yeah , so it's . I absolutely love the mindset over there . I was talking to Roscoe about it after the trial , uh , and I was telling him some of the differences in lodges and you know , mindsets and districts and , like the dd over in 21 , his name's bear , another great guy . He looks like an amish . Yeah , he looks like an amish guy that didn't commit because like he just has the chin strap and like all this is totally clean shaven . So , either way , like bears , I mean . First , he's a great senior Deacon . I watched him in a fellow craft degree the other night and he is a great senior Deacon . Um , but either way , just man , what a great group of people over in that district . It's been a lot of fun . And I told Roscoe I said look man , I got by the whenever Turkey Creek shut down .
Speaker 2I got approached by four lodges in district 20 . They wanted me to join their lodge . Um , I'm not going to name the lodges , I could probably tell you offline , but I got approached by four different lodges and it was just like no , no , I , I want to go somewhere with a fresh start . I want to go somewhere where the stain of turkey creek does not follow me . Right , you know , and I want to learn . You know , at the end of the day , I'm a . I'm good at junior deacon , I'm good at senior deacon . Outside of the degrees I can , I actually sat as a senior warden . I forgot to tell you about this .
Speaker 1I sat as a senior warden one night Weren't you going to be in the East third degree , like you and Sean Cooney were practicing together ?
Speaker 2Yeah , yeah , yeah , yeah . So well , that was for the EA degree over at Turkey Creek that I was practicing for , but it never happened . No , it never happened .
Speaker 1Ah , that sucks .
Speaker 2But no . So I was over at Lakeland Lodge . It was my first night as a member of Lakeland Lodge and they got a whole bunch of past masters there . Everything Our senior warden had to call out . He had a family , family emergency .
Speaker 2And so the worst fool comes up to me and he's like he's from Bosnia , he's like my brother . I have a question . And I was like all right , what you got , jasmine . He was like would you sit as the senior warden tonight Because Ryan's out ? And I was like Jasmine , I think the digest says that a past master has to sit as senior warden . He goes , yes , but I can't find a past master to sit in the seat . They all want to be a part of the conversation . And I was like okay , he goes . We checked , there's a right worshipful here , there's a guy who knows our digest here . We checked and I can appoint someone to sit in the West , would you do it ? And I'm like Jasmine , I've never done it before . I've been a Mason for exactly one year at this point , sure exactly one year at this point .
Speaker 2Sure , sure , give it a shot . So there , a past DI was in the room , right , honorable was in the room and I leaned over to him and I said , hey , right , honorable , and he goes . Yeah , and I said can you sit in the Marshall seat tonight ? And just like , if I mess up , hit me with a stick ? He's like , I'm like saying my lines and everything , and so after the meeting was over , he looks over at me and he was like you only missed two words the entire time .
Speaker 1That's great . Oh , because you have been practicing the degree , so you probably picked up a lot of the other chairs , so you probably picked up a lot of the other chairs .
Speaker 2No , no . So every time we open and close a lodge any lodge that I'm in anytime there's an opening and closing of the lodge I mouth everything . I sit there and say and I know a lot of people do this I sit there and say what everybody's lines are .
Speaker 2And I've been doing that ever since I started and even still , as I was memorizing the East for the EA degree , I was still memorizing everybody else's line , kind of like James Earl Jones . If you've ever heard his acting methodology , how he does it ? He doesn't just memorize his parts , he memorizes the entire script .
Speaker 1That's crazy .
Speaker 2Yeah , and so that's what James Earl Jones did and I'm like , well , if it works for him , it can work for me .
Speaker 1Let's do it it kind of is smart because , yeah , I think if you only know your part and somebody else makes a mistake , it can really mess you up . Yeah , but I think if you know all the work and somebody makes a mistake , you're already saying the right stuff in your head anyways , and it doesn't affect you necessarily as badly .
Speaker 2Well , and so here was the reason why I started memorizing everybody's part badly . Well , and so here was the reason why I started memorizing everybody's part . So I get raised December 9th of 2023 , and January I'm installed as junior deacon . Like that's how fast it happened , you know , it was less than 30 days and I was installed as junior deacon and our senior warden at Turkey Creek . I love him , but he just could not get everything down , so he every time we opened the lodge , he would open in the EA degree , every single time .
Speaker 1And so .
Speaker 2I finally took it upon myself and I was like I got to memorize the senior warden's part , because if he gets hung up on something there's nobody else . We didn't have a Marshall over at Turkey Creek so I'm like there's nobody else over here for this guy . So I would be like it's this , it's this right , you know , and try to help him along , you know , throughout opening and closing . So I guess that's kind of what started me on doing it and it's it served me well . Uh , and any new master masons , I would encourage you to do the same memorize . It's not very difficult to memorize all of it .
Speaker 1Uh , it's just gonna do it . It can be overwhelming , but if you just take a little bit at a time , you'll get there . Just keep at it .
Speaker 2Start by memorizing Junior Deacon . And even still , while I was doing my fellow craft catechisms , while I was doing my fellow craft catechisms , I was being taught Junior Deacon . Wow , so yeah , so it's like we're wrapping up . You know we're there training . You know we got multiple people in the room .
Speaker 1That's a sign of desperation , in my opinion . I would never . That would be an absolute last resort for me . Only because it's really hard to get your brain into the memorization phase when you're doing the catechisms and I would never want to confuse someone with like more stuff .
Speaker 2Well , catechisms and I would never want to confuse someone with like more stuff well , yeah , thanks for reminding me .
Speaker 1I've seen it . I've seen it in other lodges , in fact , and I've actually told people . You need to stop that . And you know some people think it's good because you want to get the new people involved . That's their thinking like get those new people involved and they'll be involved at junior steward exactly give them two years to hear everything they
Speaker 2haven't memorized . At that point they'll go to degrees , at that point they'll help . We'll have training nights , you know . And then you know , like right now , if we our training nights is every third monday , so it's like our meeting nights are second and fourth mondays and on the third , third Monday we do training . So it's like if anybody wants to sit as junior Deacon and learn junior Deacon , I don't have to . I have . I have that memorized . I have senior Deacon memorized . I've got almost all the parts memorized , except for like a handful of wording at the worshipful master station . So about transactions , like that's a weird one . So , but either way is it's like it's not difficult , just take one role at a time . Learn that role . Yeah , okay , now build on to the senior deacon . Now build on with junior warden . Now build on with senior warden .
Speaker 1And you're right . Every time you go to a meeting there's plenty of opportunities . It's basically a practice session . If you do it in your head , yeah , instead of staring at the wall and trying to stay awake , listen , listen and try to say it in your head .
Speaker 2Yeah , and then at that point , if you memorize the words early , on the only . Thing you have to memorize . After that is floor work and if you have any anomalies , like you know , the challenge to all present being master masons like that's the next thing we're going to practice is , you know the challenge .
Speaker 1Yeah , yeah , I've never participated in that .
Speaker 2I've seen it , but I've never participated in it we I'm still going to talk about turkey creek for a minute . That senior warden we had over there . He did a challenge one night and none of us were ready for it like we hadn't practiced it , but he was being cute and he was like I'm not satisfied and I , like all of us , just went like just snapped over and looked right at him and I was like I'm not satisfied .
Speaker 2and I , like all of us , just went like just snapped over and looked right at him and I was like , oh so luckily , like I was over at , I think , brandon lodge and they practiced it might have been brandon lodge , I can't remember who it was , but anyway I was at a lodge and I they did a challenge to the to that question and so our senior deacon that night kind of knew it and I sort of knew it . So it's like all right , we fumbled through it and luckily it was just our lodge that was there .
Speaker 2Not anybody external showed up .
Speaker 1Well , I've had the fortune to travel a bit and there are jurisdictions where that is part of their work . They have to do it every time , believe it or not . Every opening , they've have to do it every time . Nice , believe it or not , every opening , they've got to do that , which is crazy . Coming from florida , you're like you guys are crazy and they're like you don't do this .
Speaker 2We're like no , so we're doing our next practice session because we're going to have a dd uh reception before grand lodge . We've been told we're going to have a dd reception , um , and so I told the worshipful master whenever I first got to Lakeland I said , hey , man , one , we need to practice opening and closing , like that's a given . Like just open lodge , close lodge , like you know , let's practice that . But we have got to practice DD and Grand Master reception , because the one time we received the Grand Master over at Turkey Creek that I was there , we bombed so hard . It was embarrassing I mean embarrassing the grand honors weren't done right , nothing was done right . And it was especially funny because the night in October the grandmaster asked the DI . He was like , how was their opening ? And he goes , I'd give him a two out of five . And in my mind I'm sitting here thinking you are being so generous right now .
Speaker 2Like so generous , like cause . He was over here , he was to my right and I'm like you are being so generous right now , man . So , uh , and he goes properly . And this is the same guy that taught me how to be senior deacon . Right , and he goes . Grandmaster , the senior deacon was flawless , thank you .
Speaker 1Thank you Didn't save the charter , though , did it no ?
Speaker 2no , no , it didn't . No , but honestly
Balancing Masonic Commitments and Personal Life
Speaker 2. And so my wife , my wife talked to me about this too , cause , like whenever I would come home from a Turkey Creek meeting , I mean , I had like a 15 minute drive home and it was just phone call after phone call and text message after text message of just drama . Yeah .
Speaker 2It's just drama and so I'd get home and it's like the I wouldn't even go in and kiss my wife first , Like it was like I'm pouring me a scotch Right and then I'm going to go kiss my wife because it's like , no , this is like my emotional support , scotch so .
Speaker 1I've been there .
Speaker 2Yeah , so it was just , it was stressing me out and then , you know , coming up with a plan of action and you know , getting everybody on board . And my days were just consumed with call after call , after call . And I talked to you at one point where it's like no , I've had to charge my phone three times today . It's like no , I've had to charge my phone three times today . It's like that's how bad it had gotten . And then I get over to Lakeland . And so I came home from a lodge night over in Lakeland while I was still at Turkey Creek , and I was happy . I was like happy , like I enjoyed it , it was wholesome , had great conversations with everybody . And she looked at me and she's like matt , you need to leave turkey creek and you need to join lakeland . I was like , but , but turkey creek's my home , it's a place I was raised like I had the exact same experience .
Speaker 1Yeah , exactly the same . I I was , I my . Sarasota isn't the lodge I was raised in , and that's because of the exact same thing you just mentioned . It got to the point where when I visited another lodge , my wife said I think you're in the wrong place . Yeah , and then I would come back from meetings after I switched and she would be like so what's the drama tonight ? And I'm like none . She's like , oh , you're not going to tell me , huh , I'm like no , like no , there isn't any . She was shocked because for like a year , every meeting , you come home in a bad mood . You're stressed out . Yeah , you're writing things down , you're trying to plan because , like , how am I going to fix this fire ? Whatever the fire was that night , right , and it just it makes your whole Masonic experience so much better . I don't know how people last for years in that environment where it's all negative .
Speaker 2I think it's people who thrive on that and and there is a personality type that thrives on the drama . I mean they , they just enjoy it and it's like look , if you're that person , great , I'm happy for you . Like , I'm happy you have that , um that , but I get enough drama throughout my day . Right , yeah , I mean I work two jobs . I'm self-employed .
Speaker 1I manage another 35 year business Got young kids at home .
Speaker 2I got a kid at home . It's like I got a . I got a wife who I love and I'm so happy that she is being as patient as she is on masonry Cause . It's like last week , last week , every night I was gone for something to do with masonry , every night , oof , I did not put my kid to bed one time last week . And then it's like Friday night rolls around . It's like Friday night's my night . And then another phone call happens on Friday night and I'm just like , and it was a stupid call , like that was the thing that got me , like it was a pointless call and I'm just like , like I'm trying to eat pizza and watch a movie with my daughter , who's not seen me all week , like I've only been in there in the mornings to see her off , and it's like , and I'm gonna be gone saturday morning before she gets up to go to her traveler's lodge wait , I think I was involved with that call , wasn't it ?
Speaker 2sorry about that , I apologize it wasn't your fault , okay , um , but even still , it was just one of those things where it was like , and even still , that's why I called you today . It's like , no , you and I are fine , yeah , but it was just pointless . And so finally I just got to a point where it's like I just want to sit down with my wife and with my kid . I've been gone every night to do with masonry , and so I think it was today . We're walking around Publix today , uh , doing some grocery shopping , and she goes hey , I have a question . I was like , yeah , what's up ?
Speaker 2She goes does masonry go through different seasons of being busy and then not so busy ? And I said , yes , from what I've seen , yes , sure , in a busy season right now it should clear up here pretty soon I'm on an investigation committee for like two npd brothers . Uh , I'm on investigations for all the turkey creek guys , um , that are coming over to lakeland lodge . So it's like , yeah , we're busy right now , but if it gets too bad , I have learned the grandmaster's secret word that was lost , and that answer is no yeah yeah yeah , it's .
Speaker 1A lot of people don't want to . They think saying no is going to hurt their masonic future or something like . People will never ask them again if they say no . Right , and so they say yes to everything . And really that's not true . People respect the fact that you say no . You got a life , you got stuff going on . Say no for your own health , because masonry is a long haul . Yeah , it is not a . It's not going to be over when you're master of the lodge , that's for sure . Um , this is a lifetime endeavor , so you know you can't run at a full pace like you're running a 200 meter race for the rest of your life .
Speaker 2Yeah , you gotta pace yourself no , and in all seriousness , I had to back away from grotto and there you go and I love the guys over at grotto . I mean grotto , I kid you not from where I'm sitting right now .
Speaker 1Grotto is like five minutes that direction in which grotto are you a member of ?
Speaker 2zinda okay yeah , so , and even it's the same guys that did that um the charity bike ride to alaska and back . Very cool , read that article .
Speaker 1Yeah , yeah , so that did the charity bike ride to Alaska and back Very cool . Did you ever read that article ? Yeah , yeah .
Speaker 2So they did a charity bike ride to Alaska and back and raised funds along the way . They raised like $50,000 for Special Smiles .
Speaker 1That's cool .
Speaker 2And even still and , by the way , if anybody's listening , if you've got a place where we can send the money for Special Smiles so these are kids with developmental disabilities that insurance will not cover their dental . So it's just like , hey , apply here , you know , and they've got a war chest that they just want to give away . So , having said all that , I love all those guys over there . I still go to Grotto . I'm still a Grotto member , but I was supposed to be an elected officer this year in Grotto . And finally , the monarch over there , travis , and he's a great dude . He's got a big heart on him . I'm like Travis dude . I can't , because . Second and fourth Monday is lodge meeting nights . Third Monday is practice .
Speaker 1And third , monday is whenever .
Speaker 2Grotto meets and it's like I want to , but I can't because I have to learn Blue Lodge first , right Like but I can't because I have to learn Blue Lodge first . Right , like if I don't have Blue Lodge then I don't have York . Right , I don't have Grotto If I don't have a Blue Lodge . So I told him I was like buddy , I'm sorry I can't . And so I told him I was like , look , I'll still help with , you know , fundraising and events and all that other stuff .
Speaker 1I'll still help on that . All that other stuff is still going to be there when you get done in the blue lodge and you have more time on your hands , don't ? You're only going to make your blue lodge experience worse by participating in other lines and dependent bodies at the same time ? Yeah , I guess , depending on your lodge , maybe you've got a lodge where there's not a lot going on and it's super slow and you're bored out of your mind . It could be a different situation . But the way you're describing your current lodge is you're busy , you have an agenda , there's things going on . Yeah , you know , in that environment you definitely don't want to be a working guy and get involved in another officer line and another pendant body .
Speaker 2Yeah , and honestly I felt so bad . So I'm a York Rite Mason and my home lodge , I guess you would call it would be Plant City , york Rite Hail , compatriot , yeah . So either way , because they met at Turkey Creek , they've recently moved to like 40 minutes from here up north , so it's like the total opposite direction of way we didn't even talk about that .
Speaker 1How far was turkey creek from your house and how far is your current lot ?
Speaker 2uh , turkey creek was about 10 to 15 minutes , depending on . You know , like at the festivals in town you know strawberry festival or whatever . Um , it wasn't that bad . You know it was all back roads . Um , you know no strawberry festival or whatever . Um , it wasn't that bad . You know it was all back roads . Um , you know , no street lights , just all back roads . Um , lakeland lodge is about 20 to 25 minutes and that's interstate .
Speaker 2So bad but I do a lot of stuff in Lakeland , so it's not terrible . But , um , but either way , yeah , so York way , yeah , so york right moves up to like wesley almost wesley chapel area , which , like I said , is like 40 , 45 minutes from me , and so I'm talking to um charles , uh , um , oh man , I don't even know the york right labels , but either way , brother charles , over in lakeland , and he's like , yeah , like we need guys to show up and participate in all this other stuff , and I'm like I'll transfer my membership , but I can't promise I'm going to be active , brother .
Speaker 1Right , not right now . At some point in the future .
Speaker 2And eventually I want to be , because York right , the lessons in York right Are great and especially with , like , young millennials and Gen Zers , I think they're looking for something like York right . You know , if you look at this like day's vault movement that they're doing , god wills it . You know a lot . Look at this like day's vault movement that they're doing , god wills it . You know a lot of them are turning through . I'll send you a news article on it but a lot of them are turning to like Orthodox Christianity or or Catholicism .
Speaker 1Really .
Speaker 2It's like that's kind of right in your wheelhouse of what you're wanting , of the tradition , the um . You know the ritual of that Yep Costumes .
Speaker 1Yeah , if you're , if you've ever been a fan of Captain Crunch , you will love the hat in the commander .
Speaker 2Oh , I didn't even think about that , yep , yep , you'll have a whole bird on your head . It's fascinating , but , by the way , yeah , so that's where I ended up . Um , I love Lakeland Lodge . Um , phenomenal brothers over there . Um , I will be at Grand Lodge this year . You can't pull me away from Grand Lodge this year . I am so very excited for all of that .
Speaker 1Well , this is your first Grand Lodge , that communication that you're attending .
Speaker 2This will be the first one that I'm attending . I could have went to last year , but I was so new I was like it's kind of pointless for me to go .
Speaker 1I don't anticipate this is going to be a normal grand communication , so don't know .
Speaker 2And that's why I want to go .
Speaker 1Okay , okay .
Speaker 2Yeah , and hopefully if everything goes well . Uh , it'll be my first time officially meeting you face to face . I still have not met you face to face and show your hand .
Speaker 1It's crazy to think about . Yeah , dang nice , so do you want to keep doing this ? Matt ? Are we going to start gearing up the content machine again talking about freemasonry , or is this ?
Speaker 2totally okay with it . Um it it really depends on it's actually kind of out of our hands . Um , you know , depending on how things go in the future , on if anything you know , let's say , we go over born in blood , you know , by John Robinson , you know , could that be taken a different way ? You know , as we cover that content , so I , I'm all about it , I want to do it .
Speaker 1Yeah , no thanks , I don't want any part of that .
Speaker 2Pull up politics stuff , whether it's Masonic or otherwise , but Full up politics stuff , whether it's Masonic or otherwise , but either way I mean that's kind of what it boils down to is trying to find that sweet spot right in the middle is extremely rare . You laugh . I think I've talked to you about this .
Speaker 1I'm not laughing .
Speaker 2My 50-year goal . This is legitimately my 50-year goal is I want to start a compound out where I plan on moving , which is going to be the next county over where I want to put a school , a potentially like a Masonic home-esque style facility , a church and a Masonic lodge on the second floor of that church . I would love nothing more than to have all of that all on one property , like a good hundred 120 acre property , and it's like going to be like a Montessori style school where it's like the kids are learning stuff . They're not learning geometric algorithms , no , they're learning how to file taxes and change tires . They're learning how to build stuff .
Speaker 1Right .
Speaker 2I would love nothing more than to have something like that .
Speaker 1There
Building Business Connections Through Freemasonry
Speaker 1you go . Any investors listening ? Let's do it . Man has a plan . Let's do it .
Speaker 2Man has a plan , let's do it .
Speaker 1Man has a plan . How can they reach you ?
Speaker 2You can reach me on Facebook under Matt Stone . You can email me at matt at classicdesignspccom . If you hop on the On the Level podcast page , you're going to see me commenting on there . So yeah , reach out to me .
Speaker 1Awesome man . I really appreciate you taking the time on a Sunday to do this with me . Anytime , brother , we'll get this edited and put out real quick , and I look forward to the next one .
Speaker 2Absolutely .
Speaker 1And you guys will be hearing more from us . It's either going to be born in blood or I'm not opposed to doing some of this . Uh , christian comparison with freemasonry stuff fascinates me too .
Speaker 2We can do that I will write up and send you a top 10 and we'll dive into every bit of them okay , all right , sounds good .
Speaker 1You heard it from here on . The low podcast is out out you .
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