On The Level Podcast
Some people think Freemasonry is on the decline, not if we have anything to say about it! Join On the Level Podcast as we explore that Esoteric side of Freemasonry. We talk about the inner workings of our Fraternity, how to apply it's teachings to your every day life to become a better man, and general current events. Join our host and guests as we explore Freemasonry together and bring our ancient craft into the modern age!
On The Level Podcast
Meeting on the Level: Exploring Freemasonry's Symbols of Equality and Mortality
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Discover the deeper meanings behind Freemasonry's cherished symbols and traditions as we navigate through stories that transcend mere masonry and carpentry. This episode unravels the symbolic significance of the Level, taking us beyond its practical applications to a world where equality and humility are the cornerstones of a fraternal society. We find ourselves in awe of how even a president, like Truman, can humble himself before a fellow gardener when 'meeting on the level' inside the lodge. Our candid conversation brings to light the power of setting aside external hierarchies to embrace the egalitarian ethos that defines Masonic teachings.
Join us as we bravely confront mortality's role in shaping a purposeful life, inspired by Masonic tradition. From the profound reflections incited by the Chamber of Reflection to the ways in which mortality can unite us in diversity and service to others, we peel back the layers of fear to find a motivating force. With Chris and Frank offering their invaluable perspectives, we delve into how Masonry's confrontation with death molds its members' approach to life, empowering them to foster unity, respect, and positive global impact.
As our enriching discussion comes to a close, we ponder the lasting influence of Masonic principles on daily living. Hear personal stories that highlight the power of outreach and mentorship, showing how Masonic wisdom—through the metaphor of its working tools—can guide us on our shared journey towards truth and the end we all face. Let's carry these tools beyond the lodge, using them to forge a better self and by extension, a better world. Keep your ears open for our next episode where we'll continue to unearth insights that inspire and challenge you.
Symbolism of the Level in Freemasonry
Speaker 1Hey , chris , yeah , fred , what's a Mason ?
Speaker 2That's a really good question , fred .
Speaker 1You've reached the internet's home for all things masonry . Join Chris and I as we plumb the depths of our ancient craft , from the common gavel to the trowel . Nothing is off the table , so grab your tools and let's get to work . This is On the Level . Well , we are back . Hey , chris , how's it going man ?
Speaker 2Good , good , I'm doing alright . There's a wave of the flu going through , but we're both here .
Speaker 1Must be Superman . I thought we cured the flu . Yeah , no not cured .
Speaker 2Half my office got taken out with it this week .
Speaker 1Well , there are worse things to be taken out , that's true . I remember the flu , I've had it a few times and well a couple days later I get better .
Speaker 2Yeah , yeah , yeah , that's exactly what happens .
Speaker 1So hey , I think we are on number six , number seven when are we at here , man ?
Speaker 2This is episode six .
Speaker 1Episode six . I'm pretty happy with the way things are going here .
Speaker 2On the Level with Fred .
Speaker 1And Chris .
Speaker 2Here we are .
Speaker 1I love it hey and just a quick shout out to Jimmy C over at Sound Lounge for putting together our intros and outros , the music and the production to it . He is one of our sponsors Sound Lounge Sarasota , and more on that later . I don't want to get too far in the weeds on sponsorship and stuff . I do want to get right into our topic for today , and that topic is Chris .
Speaker 2Meet On the Level , which is very appropriate to our show . It really is Meet On the Level .
Speaker 1There must be a theme there going with Meet On the Level as our first topic of working tools .
Speaker 2Something going on there ? Yes .
Speaker 1So start us off , let's talk about the one of the working tools .
Speaker 2It is one of the working tools . Yes , and I thought we'd start by talking about what Freemasonry tells us about this tool , the Level . So the Level is used . Well , you're in this kind of industry , right ?
Speaker 1You actually use it as an operative mason a little bit as an operative carpenter , that's correct .
Speaker 2You use the Level ? What is it used in your world ? What do you use the Level for ?
Speaker 1Generally it is to plum and or level surfaces , like most people complain when they buy a new house and they get a level and they put it on the wall and it's way out , because nothing is plum and or level . So a level in that , I think in the context of masonry , level speaks to the ground . So the horizontal , the horizontal being level , because one of the other working tools is the plum , and that's a different show at a different time . Vertical , that would be vertical . So the level in this context is that flat ground . So anything being the bubble of a level , being perfectly centered between those lines , would be perfectly level .
Speaker 2Meaning perfectly horizontal to the ground . Correct Meaning no ups and downs , no hills , perfectly straight and even .
Speaker 1Right . The word that comes to mind to me is true when you true something with regard to it being level , you're truing it . So I'm thinking about a fireplace mantle , so that beautiful piece of wood that somebody made for over the fireplace , the mantle . I've made several of them and I've installed them , and that thing has to be perfectly level when you install it , otherwise it does not match the line of the ceiling and the line of the top of the fireplace and it looks , no matter how beautiful it is , it looks terrible . Anyway , a little bit of rabbit trail there .
Speaker 2On the level . Chris , you need a working tool to make it perfect .
Speaker 1You need a working tool to make it perfect , correct .
Speaker 2So that makes sense , because what Freemasonry tells us is there's a few common phrases that we use in Freemasonry , like meet on the level , or level ourselves with a fraternity or something is esoteric , as time could be a leveler of men . And so this working tool , I think , is meant to teach us a couple of things . It tells us that it's meant to keep us on the level with our brothers , and , you know , I think that means that we humble ourselves from our outside world , our titles and our positions , whatever we may think we are in the world , we're all just brothers together in the fraternity , and so we've got to kind of shed our ego a little bit . We need to make ourselves level with other people that you know , you may not even associate with if you had never met them .
Speaker 2Through the fraternity , which is one of the great things I think about Freemasonry , is that we meet these people we would never come across in our lives , either because we think they're above us or below us , or you know how we act in the world and we have these classes and stations , but in the fraternity none of that exists . I don't know if it's true . We should research this before we say it . Huh , I'm taking a note as we speak , but Rusty actually tells this story that Truman , when he was sitting president , walked out the White House back in those days they could do that and went several blocks down the street to attend his lodge meeting and the worstful master of that lodge was his gardener and he sat and humbled himself as a brother and gave authority to his gardener as the sitting president of the United States .
Speaker 2What a great example of leveling yourselves with a fraternity .
Speaker 1Right , yeah , and what a great example of a man of integrity . In my opinion . Ike was definitely the last president , in my opinion , who doesn't matter what your political affiliation is , what your viewpoint is . He's just a man who a man of integrity , a man of honesty , a man who was clearly on the level . See what I did there .
Speaker 2Yeah , beautiful time .
Speaker 1So the phrase in Lodge and I can't give anything away here and I never would but the question is always asked how do we meet ? How do we meet each other ? And the answer is always we meet each other on the level and to me it's . We meet each other in truth and , like you said , in humility . I'm not trying to sell my brother on a false bravado of who I think I am or might be . I'm trying to reveal myself and all my flaws whenever I go into the Lodge and I try to do that . In life in general , there are times when you have to be guarded in this world . Obviously you can't wear your entire life on your sleeve . That would not be wise . But when I'm in Lodge I try to be as humble and honest as I possibly can be within the Lodge , and it's caused me a little trouble here and there along the way but I've learned a lot from it .
Speaker 1But that's to me the first part of this statement . Meet on the level . That's what it means to me . So when I come into Lodge , I'm reminded immediately that I'm to take down those defenses , take down the falsehoods and just be the truest of me , that I can be to my brothers and see where it takes me , right .
Speaker 2That's a really good way to look at it , I think , and it's very Masonic . I think it cuts right to the heart of what Masonry is supposed to be about .
Speaker 1I agree .
Speaker 2But when we meet people as Masons , we're supposed to treat them as equals . That's really what it means when you meet someone on the level , since the level is used to make things perfectly even . We meet perfectly , even on the level , and that's how we should treat everyone we meet , as if we're all equals .
Speaker 1Right . Getting back to the Eisenhower analogy that he was equal to his gardener , even though he was the president of the United States sitting in Lodge under the worshipful master who was his gardener . They were on the level , can you imagine it would be awesome , I think that's awesome .
Speaker 2Yeah , that's really awesome . A great example of Masonic principles in action from a sitting president . Just would have been incredible to sit in that Lodge , I think , and see it .
Speaker 1Yeah now the other idea behind the level is traveling that level of time and talk a little bit about that . What's that ? What's that all about ?
Speaker 2Well , if you think and this is another big picture Masonic principle I think that gets really misunderstood by the general public , because we have a lot of symbols and references to death in Freemasonry .
Speaker 2The third degree in particular is very focused on the idea of death and its importance to us as humans , and I don't know what is a better leveler of humankind and mankind than the idea that we are all going to die , some of us sooner than later , but none of us are getting off of this planet alive . And so therefore , the symbol of the level and the idea of death can be very closely tied together , because death kind of strips away all of our ego , our problems , our differences , and I think death is the thing that ties us to religion very closely . For most people , their ideas about death and what happens and how your life will affect what happens in your death . And so I think there can be a very close tie between all the great religions of the world and the idea and the concept of death and the Masonic idea that we're all equals traveling upon this equal level of time , because it doesn't matter what we do , in the end we're all going to die .
Speaker 2Correct and that levels us in some way . It kind of strips away your differences and egos and makes us realize we're so much more similar than we want to admit we are .
Equality and Death in Traditions
Speaker 2So I took a couple of minutes to Google this and found a couple of . Well , I took three or four of the major religions and looked at them for ideas they have about equality and basically meeting on the level , and so I found in Proverbs 22, . The rich and poor meet together . The Lord is the maker of them . All Sounds like he's talking about equality here . Wealth and poverty each have their risk . The rich should not despise the poor . The poor should not envy the rich . Another Proverbs Right ?
Speaker 1Yeah , the writings of Solomon . Is that Solomon ? That's Solomon . Yeah , All the Proverbs are written by . Most of the Proverbs are written by King Solomon . That's correct .
Speaker 2Beautiful .
Speaker 1Yeah .
Speaker 2And Solomon is a very prominent figure in the Masonic traditions and stories .
Speaker 1Correct , yeah .
Speaker 2And all of the lessons , especially , particularly , again , the Master Mason degree . So in the Koran ? The Koran states that all humans are descendants of one man , adam , and are therefore brothers to one another . The emphasis on equality and justice in the Koran appears throughout the text and even includes one's enemies . That's news to me ? No , it's true , very true . And then you've got a fundamental Jewish principle is the equality and unity of humanity . We all have one creator , one God is the divine parent of every person .
Speaker 2And so all of these major religions of the world are kind of talking about the same message , right , that we should treat ourselves as equals , regardless of our station , regardless of our wealth , regardless of our beliefs . And that even ties into an Indian . I found a quote from the White Elk tribe leader who said treat all men alike , no-transcript , give them all the same law , give all and even chance to live and grow . All men were made by the same great spirit chief . They are all brothers . The earth is a mother of all people and all people should have equal rights upon it . So that's four now religions around the world that all talk about our Creator making us equal . It doesn't talk about us being better than anybody because of our beliefs or our wealth .
Speaker 1In fact , most of them say that wealth is not a good thing or something to be sought after , the pursuit of it or the love of it , is the basis of all evil , that's right . Yes , of all kinds of evil , I should say correctly .
Speaker 2And I think that's another misconception about masonry is that we're out to take over the world and become super uber rich guys . Yeah right yeah , which is also a misconception , because free masonry teaches nothing and says nothing about wealth being a good thing .
Speaker 1Yeah , we probably have to be really , really organized to take over the world . So don't worry guys , we're not taking over the world .
Speaker 2So now that you've seen some stated meetings and you've seen some lodges , you feel pretty confident in saying that to the listeners .
Speaker 1I do , I do . Yeah , we're not taking over the world . Hopefully we're taking over our own passions and becoming better people . But I wanna go back to the religion . I think , as you were talking about , that , all religions or all men or mankind has this similar understanding , like the Indian things talked about law .
Speaker 1Give them the same law the rich , the poor , the old , under the same law . And that , to me , that gets back to just this universal truth that all of us are going to die . This life is not permanent and we stand on the prephesis of eternity . Regardless of what you may understand that to be , we all have a date with that inevitable end . It's that saying memento mori . Remember you have to die , live your life in such a way where you're going to die , make sure that the days that you live matter .
Speaker 1And what does that mean ? Well , it comes back to what was said right there in the law , and the same thing with the writings of Solomon in Proverbs . It all comes down to there's a standard of living that we should aspire to , and the main thrust of that living , of that standard , is to do unto others as you would have them do unto you . Live on the level . That's the ultimate statement in my mind of living on the level I don't wanna treat .
Speaker 1If I treat somebody in a way that I would not wanna be treated , I am the ultimate hypocrite , I am the biggest hypocrite of all man , because that is just absolutely outrageous . So if I'm a wealthy person who goes around treating people who are less fortunate than I am , in a super negative way , then all of my wealth , all of my acclaim , everything that I've worked for is useless and worthless , and one day I'm gonna die , just like those poor people that I abuse every day , and we will be universal fact , universal truth . We will be eventually on the level all of us , it doesn't matter who you are or what you have Bill Gates , all the way down to the homeless guy that was trying to wash my window , the other day .
Speaker 1All of us will be reduced down to that final truth . We will all be on the level .
Speaker 2Yeah , the power of that's the power of death , and I think it's why it's such a prominent part of the fraternity and also one of the things that's so easy for the public to misunderstand . You know , we have the symbol of the skull and crossbones , we have the symbol of the coffin . These are all a spade which is used to dig a grave . These are all symbols in masonry and people can look at that and say look at these evil people thinking about death , talking about death .
Speaker 1It's unbelievable that how misconstrued the skull in our fraternity has been . I have family members who the skull , the coffin , the cross , all of the bones . They immediately equate the entire thing that we're some sort of Halloween cult .
Speaker 2Yes , yes .
Speaker 1You know , in dark rooms doing bad things , you know , and it's just like no , no , we're recognizing death and I'm sorry , brothers and sisters , but if you're not recognizing death , then you're not really dealing with reality .
Speaker 2Yes , yes , agree with you 100% . Even the symbol of the coffin , something so obvious that everybody knows what it is and what it's used for , became a negative thing to the outside world . And looking at us , in our lodge we used to use a prop that was a coffin in the third degree Okay , and somebody outside the fraternity sought had nothing to do with our lodge in particular , but this happened somewhere in Florida and was offended that there was a coffin being used , because they felt that this was a bad look to the outside world , that we used a coffin in any kind of a ritual , and so the grand lodge decided it was abolished in band and we can no longer use that symbol , which has been part of our ritual for hundreds of years , because it offended some outside people looking in or there was a fear that it would , and I think what a horrible way to operate from a place of fear .
Speaker 1Yeah , and also , you know my thing , and I've said this before on other podcasts any organization that changes its charter itself , that gives up on things like using a coffin in a ceremony because of outside pressure , is in danger of losing everything . Yeah , because once you start to look at the Boy Scouts of America and however you feel about them , you know good , bad or indifferent . They gave up some of their principles that they had early on and today the Boy Scouts of America is basically bankrupt , they're gone , and they simply they chipped away and they gave into social pressure and more and more social pressure until they just they're nothing . Now they're gone , and that's just one example . And again , I am not advocating or denying anything about the .
Speaker 1Boy Scouts of America . Both of my sons . When they were young they were Cub Scouts . We went through that together . But anyway , regardless , once an organization begins to cave to outside pressure , they're in danger
Death's Impact on World Improvement
Speaker 1. You know , I would be the guy that would bring a coffin back into the lodge and then send some sort of video proof of it up to the higher ups just to let them know down here we're not caving , so come on down and yell at us if you want . Anyway .
Speaker 2I should . Yeah , I mean , it's not even the first time . You know , we had a tradition before the initiation where we would put a candidate in a dark room and it would have us going crossbones right in front of a mirror and we'd make them sit there for 20 , 30 minutes and make their own conclusions about what they should be thinking about . But how can you look at a dead man and then look at yourself and not make the connection ?
Speaker 1Right , I love that , that this is where I'm headed .
Speaker 2And that puts them in a mental state where they're really prepared for that third degree , which is a lot of content about the idea of death and dying , and that also apparently scared some people or was looked too satanic to some people , and so it's no longer allowed to be used as part of our ritual . We cannot have a chamber of reflection .
Speaker 1Well , remember , chamber of reflection . Yes , how awesome would that be . I love it . We have to revive that . But here's the thing here in America , we don't die . In America , we pass on .
Speaker 2Yes .
Speaker 1We don't die . We don't talk about death . Death is not the way it was supposed to be . Death is a negative thing . It's a bad thing . Yes , it's a part of life . Everyone dies , but that doesn't make it a happy occasion . Something's wrong . Just watch a video of a tribe of lions taking down a gazelle . If they don't do that , they'll die and starve to death . But look at the scene in front of you . If you don't come away thinking to yourself , something is very wrong here . Death and the life from death , and the pain , the suffering and all of that . Something's wrong . Death is not the way it should be , but it's the reality and in Masonry we face it . We face that reality on the level . We look at death . What do you call that ? The reflection , the chamber of reflection ?
Speaker 1The chamber of reflection I feel like I need to set up a chamber of reflection in my house so that every morning I can take a couple of minutes and view that skull . I have a picture in my mind of the skulls on a table and the mirrors behind it , some lighting on it .
Speaker 2So this is all you can see . All you can see Dark , green , just the skull in you and that's all you got .
Speaker 1Yeah , I think I want to put that together and put it on our Instagram so guys can see the vision of what we're talking about there , the chamber of reflection . Anyway , I'm on a rabbit trail here . We'll save that for another podcast .
Speaker 2But yeah , that's the Masonic way for minding us . Hey , hey , hey , get your head out of the clouds , get down here , think about what you're doing . Your time is limited . Spend it wisely . And what are the most ? What should you be doing with your time , right ? Well , freemasonry tells us we should be working hard . We should be helping our community and our brothers , our family , anybody's whose life we can touch . That is the most valuable thing we can do with our time is help another person .
Speaker 1Yeah , that's right , mindfully thinking about our lives and the impact that we're supposed to be making to make this world a better place , I mean that's Masonic baby .
Speaker 2What a great segue . You said that to make this world a better place . So I'm going to read a quote from a former Secretary General of the United Nations and tell me if this guy doesn't sound like a Freemason to you All , right All right .
Speaker 2People of different religions and cultures live side by side in almost every part of the world , and most of us have overlapping identities which unite us with very different groups . We can love what we are without hating what and who we are not . We can thrive in our own tradition , even as we learn from others and come to respect their teachings .
Speaker 1That's a pretty .
Speaker 2Masonic statement . I'd say that's in line with our beliefs about the world and really the driving force of Freemasonry , which is to unite people of different races , cultures , creeds , stations in life .
Speaker 1Political parties and affiliations .
Speaker 2Even people of different sports teams . Right , yeah , and I I mean ways to just get back into the好好 understanding of this kind of fight .
Speaker 1I just I like that statement . You know , and it's true , every I find myself .
Communication and Mentorship in Freemasonry
Speaker 1I think we've done great harm to ourselves intellectually by this . You know , never talk about politics or religion . I would say never argue or fight about politics or religion . Never try to force somebody to adopt your point of view who didn't ask for it . That's , you know , that's the wrong way to go . But I have had great conversations with Mormons , with people from Islam .
Speaker 2How else will you learn ? I know , if you don't communicate about it and how well it's so true .
Speaker 1It's so true . But you know , we again I think we did a podcast on one of our early ones , one of our earlier one was talking about conflict between brothers , I believe .
Speaker 2Difficult topics of conversation also .
Speaker 1Right , our very first podcast , that's right , yeah , and talking about you know , but at the end of the day , masonry is not a religion and we're not a political party or a religion . However , we are made up of people from different religions and political parties and everyone should be encouraged to know what they believe and what they hold to and be able to articulate that to another brother with gentleness and respect and in the proper time and context . We're grown-ups , we're not children . We don't need the thought police to tell us how to behave . We're supposed to help each other and encourage each other to behave out of the best interest for the person in front of us , and hopefully that happens more than it doesn't .
Speaker 2So we're old men , you and I .
Speaker 1Some of us are older than others , chris , but , yes , go on .
Speaker 2We know those things about ourselves .
Speaker 1You know , I know who I am , I know who I'm not Right .
Speaker 2I know who I wanna be , but I see a lot of young people coming into the fraternity and they don't know who they are and they know where they wanna go , but they really don't know how to get there .
Speaker 2Yeah , that's so true and they're like trying to figure it out , and so what a great place for people to come without any kind of social stigma . Well , I guess there is some social stigma attached to being a Mason . In some groups that would be looked at as a bad thing . But in reality , if you spent any time in a lodge or around Masons , you'd see that it is all about trying to figure out , or give you the tools to figure out , who you are and how to actually be the person that you wanna be and how to actually get where you wanna go . So , even if they're not where we're at , it's about helping them get there and kind of a safe , you know , really , with a lot of love and affection and understanding , help them find their own way without ramming anything down their throat . Like you said , we're not the thought police .
Speaker 1We're not thought police but here let's talk about stuff .
Speaker 2You can overhear us talking about things and maybe you'll figure it out for yourself . You will figure it out for yourself .
Speaker 1Yeah , that's right , that's right and not showing . I'm thinking about a brother who came in . Who was he said ? He just came in , he's an EA and he said to me you know , he's looking for some direction in life . He'd gone through a really bad relationship that blew up on him and a long-term relationship and now he's here living with his mom and has got a good job and is rebuilding his life , but had no focus , no direction , and he found Freemasonry in his search for other men who are doing it right , where he can learn from , and for a lot of guys coming in . I just think this country is ripe for a fraternity of men who are just a little bit further ahead than the guy below them and is willing to share with them their life experiences and bring them along .
Speaker 1This is the epitome of on the level man . This is exactly what we're talking about here . Is that the guy who's a successful lawyer and has millions of dollars , who's a dear brother in the lodge and who knows Masonry , can take a guy like a kid like this , coming in and mentor him and help him and share with him his life experiences as equals , as complete equals and EA to a multi-degreeed , long-term brother Mason , who sit down next to each other and have a cup of coffee and talk on the level man , and that's really .
Speaker 1I think that's one of the most powerful . It is one of the most powerful aspects of Freemasonry and I'm starting to see and I'm gonna do what I can to change this one of the most neglected ideas . I see a lot of social stuff going on , which is great . We're social animals . We wanna hang out , we wanna go grab cigars and whiskies and have some fun and do all that stuff . But there is some serious business to do and we must not forget that , sitting in the lodge having dinner , across from a brother who's asking questions , if you know , if you understand and you're a little bit further ahead or even equal to that person , you need to share with that person and help that person to understand what it is we're trying to do here . And what we're trying to do here is we're trying to make us good men , better men , that we might impact the world .
Speaker 2Yes , you know , I was on an investigating committee last year or two years ago and I saw this in action . The guy was coming from another lodge out of town I won't say his name , but he was the CEO of McDonald's for many years Wow , and owns a NASCAR team now . And I see him on Fox Business being interviewed all the time . And you know this isn't about me , but I was on this interview and one of the guys interviewing him from the lodge was a 27-year-old kid that didn't have a job , that lived with his mom Wow , he's interviewing that guy Right right , I was sitting there just thinking about this situation and where else in the world Are you gonna see anything remotely like that ?
Speaker 2And the guy had the utmost respect for the kid because he's a member of the Lodge . And he's his gateway to getting into the Lodge , and so he wanted to impress it . But I'll tell you , the guy wound up turning the tables and he was interviewing us . He had us under control and many others .
Speaker 1There's a reason why he's where he's at right .
Speaker 2Mentally just a way more nimble and swift than the three of us were . I've never seen anything like it . The guy interviewed us , we didn't interview him , but that situation reminds me how Masons are supposed to meet , which is on the level . On the level , yeah .
Speaker 1So let me ask you a question then . What does on the level mean to you ? Because I have a very specific way of looking at it for me . All of the working tools , we interpret them based on how we perceive them , guided by the principles and laws of masonry . So we can look at those working tools and my interpretation of how it applies to my life could be a little bit different than yours Should be Should be a little bit different .
Speaker 1There are obvious . The analogy is a level , so you can't treat it like a plum . But so tell me a little bit about what for you in your life on the level is , and I'll tell you how I kind of look at it .
Speaker 2Yeah , I think first and foremost to me it's about being humble and always , always , always , trying to humble yourself . I might even go too far with this sometimes in my effort to be humble , because I just can't be satisfied sometimes with myself , and I will have a conversation at a lodge meeting , for example , and on the way home be beating myself up because , man , I should have kept my mouth shut . I had no business saying that . So I'm always trying to correct myself in any interactions I have with people and always be thinking about I need to be on the level with everybody , not just in the lodge but outside the lodge . So I own a company and I have employees and I try very hard when I interact with them to put them in a situation where they feel like we're just friends or we're just coworkers , that I'm not a superior and you're subordinate . Sure , that has to happen sometimes , right , occasionally , because you have to do your duty . Sure , sure , but on the whole I prefer to try to be on the level with everyone I can possibly be , and that you know .
Freemasonry's Influence on Equality and Principles
Speaker 2If I see an old person sitting alone , I think about how lonely they must be . I like to sit and talk to them , drum up a conversation . I'm not a young person above them . Let's sit down like two people .
Speaker 2You look lonely , I have a second and have a conversation , and I think those are the kinds of lessons that Freemasonry can teach us to use more in our lives , in the real world , about making ourselves more equal with the people that we have interactions with . Now the other thing I'll say because I find myself using this a lot when I have conversations that I want to keep private , I find myself always saying , if it's a Mason , hey , this is conversations on the level , right , and so I don't know that that's an official Masonic thing . But for me you ask me how I think about it and , aside from keeping myself humble , that's the other way I find myself using it in my life a lot is by when I want to have a really intense , private conversation , I'll say , hey , this is on the level , and I want you to understand it's on the level before we have it .
Speaker 1And the brother hearing that knows that this is not for public information . This is between you and I .
Speaker 2Which I don't know that that's an official Masonic , but I've heard it before . That's the only way I use it .
Speaker 1I've heard it used before as well . Yeah , yeah , and I would immediately know exactly what you're saying when you say that For me working tool when I got into Masonry . I've been in construction since I was 16 years old . I'm going to turn 60 in about 30 days .
Speaker 2So , and I've literally .
Speaker 1I've been through a lot of things in my life . I've done a lot of marketing , I've done lots and lots of sales , but the basis of my income that I have done throughout my life has been construction . So when they told me about working tools , I was like whoa , working tools man ?
Speaker 2I know a little bit about that .
Speaker 1I used to be a bit of a tool whore , which means I would buy more tools than I need because they're shiny and cool and my wife would go nuts because they're expensive .
Speaker 1But anyway , so I took , I kind of took an approach to all of the working tools and kind of applied to them , to them , what they mean to me in a very direct and generic sense , and from there I like to expound on it . Let me just share , if I can , the list and then we'll go back to the level , okay ? So for me the 24 inch gauge is my time in my life . The common gavel is a willingness to learn and work on myself . The plum is the standard that I set , the square is the standard that I apply , or that standard applied to my life .
Speaker 1The level is the path I walk , and then , of course , the trowel is doing the work , all of the work , going back to all the tools and doing all of the work . That's the trial . And then , of course , the compass would be understanding why I do what I do with all the tools , so the level being the path I walk .
Speaker 2What do you mean by that ? The path that you walk ?
Speaker 1Well , we're all walking the same path ultimately . So the path I walk , while applying the tools of masonry to my life , is that it's that path that leads to light , and , of course , that means truth . Right , there are truths , right , gravity is a truth that you can't get away from , right ? So it kind of the same idea . There are certain truths in this world that , no matter how much society wants to tell you that your truth is your truth , murder is always wrong and it's always going to be wrong . So there are truths out there . So the path that I walk is that level of time heading to that ultimate destiny that we're all heading to . We talked about this earlier in this podcast .
Speaker 1It is the ultimate leveler of all things to all men . It doesn't matter who you are or where you are . When I see the homeless guy on the street , I know that he is on the same level of time and path that I am . He's probably not making choices that are optimal for his life . Now , that's probably why he's homeless . I'm making better choices than he is , but it doesn't matter in that context because at the end of time , at the end of his life and at the end of my life , we're both going to stand in the same exact spot and have to look back . So that's for me .
Speaker 1The level is a very stark , very strong reminder that ultimately , memento more ultimately this is going to come to an end , and how am I going to use those working tools , all of them in my life to better the people around me ? And as a Christian , it's just to me , for me , in my life , as a Christian , it's just tenfold . It tenfolds the whole thing for me . It puts all of that in such perspective , of that level , I can just see it . I see a cartoon picture of me walking on this drawn line , this straight drawn line , and I'm walking towards the light . And then there's another line with another person , and another , and another , and another and another , and all these different lines going towards this ultimate place that we're all on . Some lines are better than others .
Speaker 1Some people have been given easy paths , easy being relative to who they are and where they are . Some people very difficult paths . We live in America , so our paths ? Generally speaking , we are kings and queens on the world scene . Try India , pal . If you think you got it hard , give India a shot . It's a tough place to live . There's a billion people starving over there . So , but all of those people and us and everybody else , it doesn't matter who you are , like I said Klaus Schwab , all the way down to the starving child , five year old , who has no mother and father in Africa , that they don't know what to do with . All of us will end up on that end . Live accordingly , live accordingly .
Speaker 2So the level is that path I walk , carrying my tools and using my tools in a way that would benefit myself and those around me beautiful , and I think that's a goal we should all have and you look back in history at the people that are most remembered through time , not even just in our country , but these people happen to be from our country that I'm talking about and you think about the people that created this nation we live in .
Speaker 1Mostly masons , mostly Mostly masons .
Speaker 2People that are looking to expand or create a nation based upon their core philosophy , which is equality , democracy and the freedom of thought and conversation . And how did they start this country ? We hold these truths to be self-evident that all men are created equal . That's right . It's right there in the founding of our Constitution , those Masonic principles . And the more you dig into our nation and how it was created , the more you see how how much remasonry really influenced this place and its beginnings , just absolutely true .
Speaker 1You know that we I love , I just love that opening statement . We hold these truths to be self-evident that all men are created equal . In other words , the equality of every man is obvious to all . That's the translation . Equality is obvious Even the deniers of it . When they put their head down on the pillow at night , they must know . Or when they go to the bathroom , hello .
Speaker 1I don't care who you are , I don't care if you got a golden toilet . At the end of the day , all men , women , men , all mankind are created equal . There is no advantage from a birthplace . There is no advantage . All of us are equal and endowed by certain rights . And it goes on and on what a wonderful document .
Speaker 2Had to be written by Masons . Yeah , absolutely . You read it as a Mason and you just know .
Speaker 1You just know man .
Speaker 2Man , if I was in their position , I would do the same thing . Yeah , if I was in that time and that place , I would sure as hell try to do the same thing .
Speaker 1Right , yeah , well , they saw their lives , which they were . They were living on the level being destroyed by an outside power , you know , a power that did not want them to be individuals free to love , care and help their neighbor . You know , it was a centralized force coming in to say no , we are the , we are the ones , you know , we're the ones who are going to dictate to you what is right and wrong . And they were like oh no , you're not , no , you're not , but there's , you know .
Speaker 2we talk about how to apply these things to our lives .
Speaker 2Look at how other men have applied this to their lives . Look at what they've achieved and accomplished for humanity just by trying to live the Masonic principles that they were taught in their in whatever capacity they could , and I think that that should empower us to bring it into our lives . If other men can do it , you can do it . Yeah , okay , maybe you're not Thomas Jefferson , but maybe you're not , but you can definitely aspire to be more like that in your life and you know , whatever influence you have over other people , to try to spread that philosophy with them , that we're all equal , and that is what meeting on the level means to us as Mason's .
Speaker 1Right , I am . I don't know why I thought about this , but for some reason and I'm doing some study on this and I will I will bring it eventually to a podcast , but the Hoover Dam was was conceived . Now , if , if you , if you have information on this , please email me . If I'm wrong or right or just plain crazy , email me . But from what I understand the Hoover Dam was was conceived , designed and built by Mason's . And if you go to the Hoover Dam , you will see tons and tons of Masonic symbolism . It's everywhere .
Speaker 2Oh yeah , it's big time .
Speaker 1They actually have a display and I think there's a little museum thing in there and you can go in there and it talks about Freemasonry and there's there is a compass in marble off to the side . It's been there for many years with a kind of a recording that talks about free . It's it's the coolest thing ever , man . But going back to just great achievements .
Speaker 1And it's we don't really understand . If you ever been to the Hoover Dam , you're like dang , that thing's huge . But we don't really understand the technological marvel in that , that period of time that it is , and we don't really understand what it took to build that thing and to conceive it and and to the vision of the future you know , to create Lake Powell the way they did , even though it's it's in a drought situation right now , which is kind of a different story , but but anyways it just .
Speaker 2These great achievements throughout our history are done by men who live their life on the level I love that and we're going to be talking in the future about this subject in particular the nice Templar and Freemasonry . Ok , but you know you're talking about Mason's building the Hoover Dam . We're talking about Mason's building a nation . You know the Templars built some of the world's most beautiful gothic temples yeah , that's true that to this day we still have never seen . So you know , think about those builders that were part of that organization and what they built at that time and try to tell me that Mason's aren't linked through in some way , through the Knights Templar , because I want to have that conversation soon .
Speaker 2And that's going to tie into this , what we're talking about right now the construction of those gothic temples , and the skill that's unmatched , even hundreds of years later . Right , how do they do it and how did they have such , you know , talented craftsmen as part of this military organization that was run by the state ? Which is controlled by the church .
Speaker 1Well . Well , there you have it , guys . Future Stay tuned for future podcasts . So , hey , that was . That was great conversation , chris , I think . I think there's there's some takeaways to this topic meeting on the level , and if you have a takeaway , if you have comments or insights that you'd like to share , please email us and send us your comments . Comment , leave us a five star rating , of course , of course Apple podcast , please , and smash that like button . Wait , isn't that a different platform ?
Speaker 2I don't know , there's so many platforms . Gotta be able to like this somewhere .
Speaker 1Whatever platform you are listening on , we want you to know we appreciate you and we appreciate you staying to the end to this conversation . This our sixth podcast , look for the seventh , go back to the fourth , check out the first . Just again , we just really appreciate you know , you guys hanging out with us and Chris , anything you want to say on the way out , man .
Speaker 2Yeah . I had one thought and I wanted to mention it you had said something earlier about we're never gonna take over the world , you know when you when you get into the fraternity , you see it's not , you know , gonna be the case , right .
Speaker 2But I had a thought that , although I agree with you , we're not organized well enough to take over the world . That's because it's not our purpose . I think that one of the things that I'm really happy that I joined the fraternity , because I've realized if anything wants to ever happen some kind of nuclear war or something that on that level and the governments went away this like loosely connected fraternity could be the structure that could continue to hold us together .
Speaker 2I agree with that we have it all here right the moral law , the law of man , the respect for each other , the caring for each other a system of justice and we can still operate , you know , independently as cells . I think it's a great system for the future , if anything was to ever happen , and that gives me some comfort .
Excitement for Future Podcast Episode
Speaker 1I love it . I love it . Great point to end on . Alright , guys , we'll see you on the next one , number seven , look for it on your Apple podcast . Chris had a great time . Thanks , frank .
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