On The Level Podcast

Crafting Manhood: A Fresh Look at Masculinity within the Lodge

January 27, 2024 Christopher Burns Season 2 Episode 6
On The Level Podcast
Crafting Manhood: A Fresh Look at Masculinity within the Lodge
On The Level Podcast
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As we weave through the intricacies of life's commitments and the vibrant streets of Key West, my recent absence becomes a prelude to an episode rich with Masonic enlightenment and heartfelt connection. Let me take you on a journey with me—through the Southeast Masonic Education Symposium to the very core of Freemasonry's teachings on balance, commitment, and the pursuit of wisdom. Our path is illuminated with discussions on the importance of mentorship, the profound symbolism in our ancient tradition, and the harmonizing of astrology with science—melding the mystical with the practical in a way only Freemasonry can.

You'll join me in examining the literal and metaphorical significance of 'traveling in foreign countries' within our craft, digging into the goldmine of resources like the Mentors' Manual that can guide us on our quest for mastery. Imagine standing on the shoulders of operative masons of old, grasping secret modes of recognition, while navigating our modern landscape with the same zeal for continuous learning and growth. In these shared moments, we uncover the tapestry of language and customs that shapes our brotherhood, reinforcing the bonds that tether us to one another and to the morals that define us.

We won't shy away from confronting the complexities of masculinity and the specter of toxicity that haunts modern discourse. Through the allegorical lens of the three Ruffians, you'll discover how our teachings dissect and redefine manhood in a context that uplifts rather than oppresses. As we wrap up this enlightening season, I'm calling upon you, my fellow seekers, to contribute a piece of your creativity—a new parting saying that captures the essence of our shared journey. Your voices are the chorus that gives life to our global brotherhood, and it's with a brimming heart that I thank you for tuning in and promise more candid content as we continue our collective pursuit of light and knowledge.

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Speaker 1:

Hey, chris, yeah, fred, what's a Mason?

Speaker 2:

That's a really good question, fred.

Speaker 1:

You've reached the internet's home for all things masonry. Join Chris and I as we plumb the depths of our ancient craft, from the common gavel to the trowel. Nothing is off the table, so grab your tools and let's get to work. This is On the Level. Well, hello. Well, hold on, man. I'm searching for something here. I can't find it. I lost something. Do you know what?

Speaker 2:

I lost my glasses.

Speaker 1:

It was an entire week I've lost an entire week and we have to apologize to our brothers out there for completely falling off the planet into some sort of strange abyss climbing our way back out, realizing that we went an entire week without putting out a podcast.

Speaker 2:

Shame on us. I have no memory of what you speak. I just closed my eyes. We just recorded a podcast. Did we miss something? We missed a week, dang it.

Speaker 1:

It happens. It happens Now. What we could do is be clever and blame it on technical difficulties.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, let's go with that.

Speaker 1:

Technical difficulties. No, it wasn't technical difficulties. What it was is Fred and Chris being way too busy, yeah, and not doing a great job with our cable toe and our 24 inch gauge. So let's just confess that to the brethren right now.

Speaker 2:

Here's the deal. It's my fault. I had a medical procedure, a preventative procedure that men have.

Speaker 1:

Please don't share.

Speaker 2:

I won't, but it did take a couple days of my attention. Immediately after that went to Key West for my anniversary, where I just refused to plug in.

Speaker 1:

And I don't blame him.

Speaker 2:

Just got back yesterday and here we are this morning, nice, catching up.

Speaker 1:

So it's my fault. It's not his fault. It is.

Speaker 2:

That's a lesson learned. We got to have some in the can.

Speaker 1:

That's right. We're working on getting some in the can and in season two. That is the big goal. We are upgrading our tech for season two. Just so everybody knows, we got a new switchboard and a couple of other toys that I'm pretty excited about. I'm home geeking out on all of it.

Speaker 2:

We are proud of this technological terror you've acquired.

Speaker 1:

We're going higher tech. I mean you could tech out on this gig big time, but we'll probably never go that far. The ultimate tech for me is to hire an actual production producer who does all this stuff. We don't have to do it, but that's a pipe dream, because that's you know, that's successful man situation. That's a successful man situation. We are currently in the in the want to be successful man. Oh hey what?

Speaker 2:

you know what? What something happened since the last time we recorded. Please do share, brother. We went to Hillsboro Lodge.

Speaker 1:

We did.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, we were at Hillsboro Lodge. What a great experience, man I at the Southeast Masonic Education Symposium happened on what may 29th, 29th.

Speaker 1:

That'd be April 29th April. Yeah, a good time was had by all that's. That's what I can say. And it was such an honor to be surrounded by such such good brothers, you know, and, and that was an experience.

Speaker 2:

Just a full day of Masonic everything Right, right. Just talking about history, talking about hoaxes, talking about, like, how astrology and the study of science applies to us as masons Like my mind was going right.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah, it was a fire hose. It was a fire hose of information continuously and I welcomed it because, you know, honestly, I took away, I made, I took notes during the different seminars.

Speaker 2:

And then in the Journal of Insane Writings he has legitimately, like a from the Indiana Jones Holy Grail book. You know, it's got like drawings and maps, and notes.

Speaker 1:

It's like if I don't get it out of my head, I'll surely go insane.

Speaker 2:

So it's got to go somewhere as it goes in that little book.

Speaker 1:

Anyway, for me, I taking notes. I got something out of everything. Yeah you know that was there and I was like I'm going to go to the conversation that we were talking to the guys and just that was some spirited.

Speaker 2:

There was like a round table at the end.

Speaker 1:

Was that what you call that? That was kind of the open discussion panel discussion. There you go. Thank you very much.

Speaker 2:

And that conversation was spirited. I mean, people are really passionate about Freemasonry.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, man.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, they're talking about the value of it, the concerned about the kind of quality people we might be bringing in, like, ok, what are, I think, our peoples?

Speaker 1:

I think every district should consider doing one of these at least once a year. I recommend every six months. But it is so good to bring together these speakers and any kind of speaker, anybody who's doing a speaking circuit about Freemasonry you know that you can find who's recommended and put together a symposium like this. We talked to the Worshipal Master up there.

Speaker 2:

Great guy, what a great man what a great man, he is.

Speaker 1:

He's the one that invited us to this and he invited us to it and he put him and his senior warden no secretary secretary Billy shout out to Billy that was their baby and they put it together and they did such a great job. But my point is that if you're listening from another district or even from another country, since we have listeners from all over the world do this, put this together. He said. Worshipal Master said that it was. They made a little bit of money on it. They didn't make a lot of money on it, but they didn't lose any money on it, but it was such a powerful time for all of us, you know, for everyone to get together. It was Masonic education on steroids is what it was including fellowship, you know. And there was food, there was good coffee, good conversation, it was like.

Speaker 2:

And the after party, they even had an after party.

Speaker 1:

The after party was great. There were cigars and whiskey.

Speaker 2:

Good food I was. I was extremely satisfied as a Mason driving home that night Just felt absolutely. Masonic brotherly love.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah, I was like three inches, three feet off the ground.

Speaker 2:

Well, you were like a you know a fish in the water just swimming so happy they're presenting. Clearly that's your strong suit.

Speaker 1:

I was very happy with our presentation. I, you know it's. It's something I love to do. I just love to make the crowd is the reason we're there. The men who were there, we're not there for me, we're not there for you, we're there for them and we put together a program which I thought was pretty good, pretty darn good. If you can't, in your district, do it, then I would recommend please, please, attend the symposium next year. That will definitely be going on. There was talk of doing one every six months, kind of going back and forth. There was a little bit of talk about that. I'd be a big fan of something like that, but that would not be up to me. But anyways enough about that. Thank you, thank you awesome. Thank you, everybody and thank you to everybody listening for all of the support that we're getting literally from around the world, people emailing us and encouraging us.

Speaker 2:

Met some big fans from up in Tallahassee, was it?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, shout out to Tallahassee. I hope for brothers from Tallahassee, but one in particular was Paul.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, yeah, Paul, yeah, he was like a great shout out to.

Speaker 1:

Paul See now, we're gonna miss, we're missing we're gonna miss other people.

Speaker 2:

I broke your rule.

Speaker 1:

We broke the rule, so, but anyways, worthy shout out to all who participated. So today we are gonna jump back into Master Mason out of the manual and I'm just gonna read from it. This time I thought we'd jump into the to travel in foreign countries because we left off with the symbolism of the temple last time. So let's just jump to 5.19 to travel in foreign countries, and I'll read it and receive Master's Wages, which is our way. The wages of a Master Mason is 5.20, so that works out really well. We can just jump right into that. So I'm gonna read from the Mentor's Manual. That is the 2008 revised Mentor's Manual Free Accepted Masons of Florida. It's known as GL217. Every lodge should have a copy of this laying around. Multiple copies, hundreds of them, hundreds of them.

Speaker 2:

Grab it read it, it's online if you can't find it. If you can't find it, it's online.

Speaker 1:

grab it, read it know it, share it, be all about it. It is worthy of your time.

Speaker 2:

It's under the education section of the Grand Lodge website.

Speaker 1:

Right, right and well. It's a really, really helpful website. I gotta say, man, I'm in there all the time.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, get your petitions there if you can't find any at the lodge.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah and the other great thing about that website. Just quick plug for that website. If you can't find something on that website, if you call, they will absolutely help you, or if you email, they'll get back to you almost immediately with an answer to your email. I had a question about doing some demographics studies about demographics and I was having a hard time finding it online and the secretary, she shot me back an email within two hours and pointed me in the right direction and it was like bam done, I love it. Man, that was huge.

Speaker 2:

All right.

Speaker 1:

So we're going to read again from 5.19 in the Mentors' Manual, that's on page 23,. To travel in foreign countries. The ultimate goal of our ancient operative brethren was to become master masons so that they might possess secret and secrets and knowledge which would enable them to practice the arts of the builder wherever, where so ever they travel, even in foreign countries. The brethren of the speculative craft still desire to travel in foreign countries, and those who feel the urge strongly enough to study their masonry diligently that they may receive proper instructions and be permitted to travel and receive master's wages. Foreign countries, as used in Freemasonry, is a symbolic place not connected with any particular geographical location, nor is it a work of identification which will enable us to build material temples or earn higher wages for the work which we do. It is a symbol which has more than one interpretation. Freemasonry itself is a foreign country to each initiate. If he is to travel in it, if he is to earn master's wages, he must learn its language, understand its customs and study its history. He must become a part of it to fully appreciate and enjoy its privileges and pleasures. Becoming a master mason gives each man the right to travel in foreign countries. In Freemasonry, he has but to learn its works and keep himself in good standing to find the doors of 100 lodges open to him. He will also find much pleasant traveling to be done in the writings of Freemasonry. These cover the fields of history, philosophy and branch into numerous other areas, leading to countless treasures which each must discover for himself. These are some of the rewards of the mason who travels in foreign countries.

Speaker 2:

I love the way that's written. That's really good. It's very eloquent, Right.

Speaker 1:

Yeah.

Speaker 2:

The grammar and rhetoric is off the charts. But yeah, so in operative masonry, they teach us that the reason for the secret handshakes and the secret words is to identify themselves as being proficient enough in their craft to be worthy of being called a master mason, which would allow them to travel and build structures in foreign countries commiserate with their skill level, which was verified by a word or a grip. Right, that's what they teach us in history, or where our tradition comes from. Is that operative masonry, these secret words being currency that allowed them to essentially prove where they are in travel in foreign countries?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, so.

Speaker 2:

Which happened at a time when people couldn't travel freely to foreign countries.

Speaker 1:

And you know, somebody came to you as a builder, or perhaps you sent for them and they would come to you. You didn't know much. You didn't know anything about them except for what they told you. However, because this man had in his possession the grip and secret words of the master mason, the master builder, you could trust him because the organization itself was trustworthy, it was well established and everybody knew this man is who he says he is and this man can do the job Right, and I love the analogy.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker 1:

I love the analogy. Right that what you know. We can't talk too much about it, but what makes you a master mason? Well, everybody who's a master mason listening knows what the answer to that question is. Can't say it on a podcast, but you know what it is.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, you know, and that Something we all share Right.

Speaker 1:

And the operative guys were. You know, that's why you know, that's what made them what they are and that's their motivation was behind that. You know, for us, in the speculative way, it's the same way and I like the way it. Just it talks, it takes it out of the operative, which, of course, as we all know, is those who actually did the actual work operative masons and it takes us into the speculative, those of us who take all of it for it as an analogy for living our lives, for building our temple right and we travel the it said here the foreign countries as using free masons is a symbolic place not connected with a particular geographical location, nor is it a work of identification which will enable us to build material temples or earn higher wages for the work which we do. It is a symbol which has more than one interpretation. Free masonry itself is a foreign country to each initiate.

Speaker 2:

That's really interesting. I never thought of it that way. Free masonry is a foreign country.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, it is.

Speaker 2:

It is, and now we're working in foreign countries.

Speaker 1:

And if you wanna be in that country you gotta learn its language. That's like it said and you gotta learn the language, the customs, traditions and the traditions and history of it if you wanna be proficient in this country that you now find yourself this foreign land.

Speaker 2:

It is a bit like that, isn't it? It is they give you that book and it's coded into you and it's like a foreign language.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, you have to learn the language.

Speaker 2:

A little instructor that tries to teach you how to read and write and speak in this foreign language. And you do this with other brothers of yours and yeah, I mean, then you've gotta prove a proficiency in front of your brothers. And I presume that there would have been the similar process for operative masons, where they would be taught how to Do their craft and then there would be some kind of a test right in front of some elders that would determine if they were proficient enough.

Speaker 1:

Well, the test is the, the product that they produce. So they, you know, they were down their quarrying stone, and when that stone was brought up to be said, if it wasn't right, well then you're not proficient. Yeah there, you know, the, the. The proof is is in the work, right, and isn't that true?

Speaker 2:

That's true in everything right, yeah, I mean, show me what you know, don't tell me what you can do. Right, I like that.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, you can tell me all you want, but until you show me, until I show you or you show me yeah we're really just talking, you know, and I think, if you can prove it, you're worthy right.

Speaker 2:

Correct, you're like this is great work. Somebody taught you. Well, you have maybe. Maybe it's not perfect, perfect, but they were looking for someone proficient enough to be able to Build certain things right, so maybe you didn't have to be perfect.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, um, wherever I go in our travels, there's a couple of men From our lodge who, everywhere I go, their name is is held in honor.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, we're lucky like that.

Speaker 1:

We're lucky like that and and it doesn't matter how far I travel, there are, there are several men in our in, in, you know, in my life right now, which I'm so grateful for, who, when I mentioned their name, like, yeah, that's a stand-up guy, man, that's, that's his. He's earned his wage. You know his, his reputation is evidence of his work so true, you know and the opposite is true as well. There are a couple of men that when his, when their names are mentioned, eyes roll and people like, yeah, I don't, I don't know they bring nothing but trouble nothing but trouble. And they have also earned a wage, and that is a wage of negative, you know reputation.

Speaker 2:

Well, you said that in the speaking engagement we had at Hillsborough lodge. You said we were talking about coming to Freemasonry with mercenary motives and you said people that Come here looking to make a name for themselves yes, we'll make a name if you if you come to masonry to make a name for yourself?

Speaker 1:

I guarantee you you will. The problem is, is you probably? It's probably not the name you would have chosen, and we've seen that right. We've seen some people who are overly ambitious. In the wrong way to make a name for themselves, and they certainly have. And their name is notorious. Yeah, you know and um, but in a good way not in a good way.

Speaker 2:

The name you know instantly something negative.

Speaker 1:

Right, because, because masonry, we preach on the level, on the level, on the level. And when you're trying to put yourself above someone or trying to to to circumvent that, that equality of brotherhood, yeah, it stands out.

Speaker 2:

It's like wait, hold on even even an ea.

Speaker 1:

You know who's just learning is going to say hey, wait a minute.

Speaker 2:

Shouldn't he be, aren't we?

Speaker 1:

supposed to be on the level. That guy is kind of putting himself above everybody.

Speaker 2:

You see that. You see the people who are trying to pull the political levers to try to advance, maybe faster than right others would if they did it, naturally through hard work. That's all here. It's all part of free masonry, because people are here, but what it's telling us is to work hard and earn our wages. And you can't earn wages without working hard. You can't have an honest day, slayber and feel good about it at the end of the night and put your head down and sleep like a baby unless you gave it all. And I feel like those people that are short, cutting their way through life and to the top and free masonry and outside free masonry Probably don't sleep that well at night.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I hope If, if they don't sleep well at night, that means their conscience is still alive. That's what I mean. That's just hope. Yeah, yeah, there's hope there.

Speaker 2:

Hopefully they're not and hopefully that if over time they'll come around and free masonry can help with that, it really can help. It's supposed to that kind of person make adjustments in my life. Yeah, and if we're doing our job and this is something else we talked about at the symposium If we're doing our job and we really love our brothers, it's our obligation to whisper wise counsel in their ear. Correct, we're told? This is something we're supposed to do To help our brothers and help ourselves is Whisper wise counsel in the ear of an airing brother. Tell them what you think is going on and and what do you say? Loving gentleness.

Speaker 1:

Uh, kindness and gentleness right, with respect. Kindness and gentleness right. Do it with hate in your heart, no like.

Speaker 2:

You're just not like that. But you say hey brother, I just want to. You know, I care about you. I see this is going on. My suggestion is this and they can do with that what they will. You did your part. You'll sleep good at night.

Speaker 1:

Right, talk about a foreign country man that's foreign to everything in our society. Right, pulling a brother aside and trying to help him get over Um, something you're seeing in his life, that's negative, that's not good, that is not done out there In the world. Man, out there in the world people are, are you try to bring up to somebody, unless you're their boss, and even then it's tough. But if you try to bring up a something in their lives, they're immediately just recoil from it. You know, how dare you talk that way to me? How dare you? You know? There's that lack of total lack of self reflection and humility out there you know, and it's just like and, and and one of. I think one of the reasons our society is so separated Is because we don't have those close relationships. Yeah you know, built on a common goal that we can. You know that we can build close relationships and then be able to speak into someone's life. I can't speak into the life of someone I have not earned, earned the right to. You know I I have to have a relationship. I have a relationship with you. You have a relationship with me, we can speak into each other's life. You know, and, and tell each other hey man, that ain't right. You know, you're gonna have to see, you can have to fix that bra. You know and, and, and you can receive it. I can receive it Because we have relationship with each other. Our society has been so fragmented and we've all become these lone rangers. You know that we can't, we can't hear it. You know when people want to tell us hey man, you know what you're doing is going to harm your. You're gonna harm yourself. Yeah, you know, and I care enough about you To to say something because I'd like you to better yourself. You know, that's the only. Oh. No, you're trying to harm me, you're trying to. You know, and it's, yeah, it's.

Speaker 2:

you don't run my life, I run my life, that's right, that's. You're not the boss of me, said the four-year-old a good mason should receive it In the same way that you gave it. Yeah, that's right. So if you gave it in good intention and to help someone, they should receive it with gratitude, even if they disagree with what you're saying, and say thank you, brother. I appreciate you bring that to my attention.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, this, this themes comes up a lot, because when we did our, we did the esoteric discussion group around the fire yeah, this came up too. This comes up a lot, this whole. Speaking into the lives actually, yeah bringing building relationships To the point where you can speak into each other's lives.

Speaker 2:

It's great because I think it's really important. The guys that are really studying free masonry and really working at it are the ones Saying that they do this and everyone should do this. I think it's uh. Something that, if you're gonna be serious about it, it needs to become part of your life, is Caring enough about somebody to help them correct something in their life in free masonry. That's why we're all here, right, supposedly so, allegedly. I mean, that's kind of expected, I think is for people to check you, help you check yourself. Um, and that's what we're doing is working together. If you were working side by side in a quarry in the Uh 1300s with another mason and you saw him Constantly, you know, messing up these bricks that took them a month to get out of the freaking granite. Right Are you just gonna let him keep doing it. No, are you gonna go over there and be like, hey brother, look, this is, this is how you do it, this is how I see what's happening over there, and I think if you follow it this way, you're gonna save us all a lot of time because we're gonna get this. Right building done faster if you do the work right.

Speaker 1:

That's what we got to do, right, and if he can't receive that, then he's gonna be out of off the team. Imagine so how long is he gonna stick around?

Speaker 2:

How long is everyone gonna let him know?

Speaker 1:

one's gonna let him because we've got to produce these stones, right, because the fellow craft is coming by any minute, who's you know who's overseeing us, and he's gonna be like this is wrong, who's doing this? And he's gonna say this is this, is this is kind of that next level, right? So the group, a group of of men in a quarry doing, you know, doing quarry work, one of them's not not holding up the standard, and they're trying their best to help that that brother to get to the standard. Um, and he refuses to do so. What's gonna happen is it's gonna, it's, it's not gonna be in their hands anymore, it's gonna go to the next level. The next level is gonna be the you guys to go.

Speaker 2:

It's coming by.

Speaker 1:

It's like dude if you can't if you can't fix this, we're gonna have to go a different way. Oh, yeah, yeah, they're gonna, they're gonna be all angry and mad and they're just, it's just gonna go higher and higher until they find themselves on the outside of the quarry. Man, you know with no job. Yeah, Hopefully the system works itself out of those kinds of people but again let's go back to the beginning, based on Deep relationships between small groups of men. You can't have deep relationships with every single basin in the world. It's just not that way not honestly, but there, everyone has four or five guys in their lives and I would encourage everybody listening right now, if you, if you can Find those four or five guys and reaffirm to them this week, reaffirm to them that, hey, do we have the kind of relationship where I can tell you Things and you can tell me things that you know negative things in our lives that we might need to change, or do we have that relationship? Go find those guys and say that and and and just wait for the look on their face. That'll tell you if you do or not, right there. Becoming a master mason gives each man the right to travel in a foreign country. In Freemasonry, he has but to learn its work and keep himself in good standing to find the doors of a hundred lodges open to him. He will also find much pleasant traveling to be done in the writings of Freemasonry. These cover the fields of history, philosophy and branch into numerous other areas, leading to countless treasures which each must discover for himself. These are some of the rewards of the mason who travels in foreign countries. I just love the way that ends. Man, that's really good, you know.

Speaker 2:

We each find our own riches.

Speaker 1:

Well, we love story, right? We telling. Telling truths Through stories and through analogies is how we learn yeah as humans. And it's, it's a time-tested Method of teaching. You know, from the gospels and the parables and the gospels down through history. It we learn through stories. You know, and and those, and, and I just love the way Freemasonry is right up my alley man, because that's, that's the way I learn, you know. I like to tell stories and and I like to hear stories because they're memorable and and they can, they can, you know, they can speak into our lives. So the next one 5.2 zero is the wages of a master mason. I have not read this, so I'm gonna.

Speaker 2:

Oh first time read through first time read here.

Speaker 1:

I know the first one sounded like a first time real score.

Speaker 2:

You want a scale of 1 to 10?.

Speaker 1:

Okay, here we go. Our ancient operative brethren performed manual labor and received these elements which would contribute to their physical welfare. The normal, the normal wages of a master were therefore corn, wine and oil, together with the other necessities of life as these were required. The wages of a speculative Mason must come from within, as he is concerned with moral rather than physical labor. Pgm Carl H Clowdy has aptly said that each brother asks what he will and receives that for which he labors. I worked for, I worked for Mentals High. I worked for Menlands Higher, only to learn, dismayed, that any wage I asked of life, life would have paid the. The intangible. The intangibles of love, friendship, respect, opportunity, happy labor and association are the wages of a master who earns them. Not all do earn them. Hence the phrase in the mouth of the lodge officer, descriptive of his duties, to pay the craft their wage, if any be due if any be due, so that that little quib right there I'm gonna have to go back. That was a little tough to. That was a little old English there but sorry, I messed that up.

Speaker 2:

I think it's. It is true and powerful, like we're not all trying equally and the people that try the hardest should get the most rewards.

Speaker 1:

Right the. The intangibles of love, friendship, respect, opportunity, happy labor and association are the wages of a master who earns them.

Speaker 2:

Well, you're talking about just living a full, fulfilling life there. Right, right, you have friends that trust and respect you. You have family that you love and that trust and respect you and hopefully so your hard work and respect. You've scratched out a living for yourself and you're not struggling for money either. That's a fulfilling life, a sense of security, happiness and fulfillment of purpose. That's in in. That's there you go. They're saying this is the kind of life you can live if you do the work of trying to improve yourself. Right, I hear.

Speaker 1:

I hear some masons say to me you know well, I just didn't, I wasn't getting much out of it. You know, I don't go to. I don't go to Blue Lodge anymore because it's just you know it's just the same old thing and it's like an HOA meeting and I'm just not really getting you know anything out of it. And in my mind this, even though I really haven't pondered this much, that's why, reading the Mentor's Manual, is such a good idea.

Speaker 2:

What are you giving? What are you giving to it, Right?

Speaker 1:

you're asking for wages that you haven't earned Right Is really what you're doing.

Speaker 2:

You're expecting wages and complaining that you're not getting wages that you have not earned, you haven't paid, you haven't paid your dues, you haven't done the work.

Speaker 1:

And that's what it is we are. We are a work-based fraternity. You're going to get out of this what you put into it, and I just think of Brother Dobbs, who that's, that's his thing participation man.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker 1:

What's the, what's the number one advice you could give to us? Brother Dobbs, I have to man One word participation.

Speaker 2:

It's so true, right, and he told me that's been his whole Masonic career. He just shows up.

Speaker 1:

Yeah.

Speaker 2:

He doesn't have a plan, he's just around.

Speaker 1:

He sure looks like he has a plan.

Speaker 2:

But you know his plan is to just be there and when you're, when you're there and when you show up and when you're confident, people are going to ask you to do things and you wind up doing more work, and that's what happens to him.

Speaker 1:

And it's enriched his life. I'm sure he'd tell us that right now you know, or when we interview him at Grand Lodge. Wink, wink.

Speaker 2:

Well, you look at the respect that he has from the people that we know, and it's not just respect out of fear, it's respect out of love, because he did it the hard way. He didn't, he didn't ask, he didn't politic for anything. He's gotten. Other people came to him and were drawn to him because of what he offers to the crowd.

Speaker 1:

Right, right. It's a great example for all of us.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and we have multiple people in our district. We can point to that Absolutely.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I say that a lot and I just I brag a little bit on our district.

Speaker 2:

We're in. It's just. It's like a magical place in Freemasonry that we get to play in here.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, it's so true, and and I want other people from other Florida districts to call up and disagree and brag on theirs- which would be great and oh and, by the way, our new tech is going to allow us to take callers.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, so I cannot wait for that. That'll be awesome. So we'll start live streaming then and while we're recording, and maybe we'll try it.

Speaker 1:

We'll try it. Yeah, we'll be able to do all that if, if the engaged users and real friend can get over the learning curve, which I think he probably might be able to. We'll see how that goes. The confidence. So I'm going to try that quib again. You ready? I worked for. I worked for Menlands hire only to learn, dismayed, that any wage I asked of life, life would have paid. That's pretty good Men's really hired?

Speaker 2:

I don't know who?

Speaker 1:

I guess that's a person. I worked for someone's hire, only M E N I A L apostrophe S Menles, Menles hire. I worked for Menles hire. Maybe it's an old English word oh menial hire, oh menial is hire.

Speaker 2:

So that's work. That does not wait, let's just stop right there.

Speaker 1:

Stop right there. It is menial and I'm even wearing my glasses right now. I worked for menials hire, so menial meaning mundane kind of labor, right, common labor. I worked for commons. Labor is high, I work, it's common.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker 1:

Right Menial meaning common, so I worked for menials hire only to learn, dismayed, that any wage I asked of life, life would have paid. There you go. The wages of a speculative Mason must come from within, as, as he is concerned with moral rather than physical labor. So and that's, and that's what is it. It's this, this, right here, 5.2. I'm going to encourage everybody because I'm going to do it Study this a little bit, ponder this and meditate a little bit on this. I think there's a lot here. There's a lot here for esoteric teaching and understanding here, the wages of a master Mason, and I really like the way this, this is worded. It. We can't just jump into it here on a podcast and just spout out some, some great wisdom which tells you two things One, there's a lot of wisdom to be gleaned out of this and two, we're. You know, we don't know what we're doing.

Speaker 2:

So well, I mean, this is really interesting because you know if somebody that's profane heard you say that they'd be like you got a cult there. They're trying to foresee to work as much as possible for free for them.

Speaker 1:

Oh, right yeah.

Speaker 2:

What you're saying in that section? What they're saying is this and men as men, we want to work hard. Right, we want to like get test my back. I'll lift some logs, I'll go to the lodge and chop weeds and stuff. That's not the work they're talking about. They're talking about moral work. They're talking about working on your internal soul.

Speaker 1:

That's right.

Speaker 2:

And morals of yourself inside, which is not easy for men to do, because we want to exert our masculinity on the world and chop trees and split wood and do work like that, because that's what makes us feel manly. But this also goes back to something that you I think I brought it up and you hammered it home at the at the speech we gave is the toxic masculinity thing.

Speaker 1:

Yeah.

Speaker 2:

So masculine doesn't mean necessarily chopping wood into pieces with a big X. That's not like the ideal of masculinity. The ideal of masculinity is helping people weaker than you and protecting people that don't have your strength. That's masculine. And so that you know, that's not something that we're born with, that's something we have to work at, I think.

Speaker 1:

Right.

Speaker 2:

Absolutely, and the way that we work at it is doing the work in masonry, which is what you just called people to do. Reflect on that.

Speaker 1:

Meditate on Meditate.

Speaker 2:

Think about that that's the work that we're supposed to be doing in masonry, right, right Thinking.

Speaker 1:

Think, critically, thinking over issues and discovering what do I believe, why do I believe it? That's critical thinking 101, you know. But talking about the toxic masculinity, I just the concept is we're a fraternity, so we're all men, so we're already got some points against us in the in the world out there, in the modern society, the modern society doesn't, doesn't like fraternity. So I'll just say this Did and I said this at the symposium. I think it's worth saying again. Did you ever think that the phrase it's good to be a man would be a controversial phrase? Could, could anyone have ever thought that that phrase but it is. It's extremely controversial to say it's good to be a man is a controversial phrase. But you know, and that and the phrase, that phrase toxic. Masculinity I still maintain, even though I got a little bit of pushback at the symposium about it, I still maintain is an oxymoron. They don't go together. If it's toxic, it's not masculine, it's something different. It's, you know it's. It's, it's because masculinity isn't toxic, masculinity is. We, like I said at the symposium as well, we're the protectors, the providers. You know we're supposed to give of ourselves. Yeah, you know to not not do what I want, but do what must be done for the good of the family, for the good of the community, for the good of the fraternity. That's what masculinity is. There's nothing toxic about that.

Speaker 2:

The things that are identified as toxic masculinity are animal masculinity right. Right An animal can an animal can get aggressive, an animal can beat you. An animal can do all those things.

Speaker 1:

That's not masculine, no, that's, that's, that's not it, that's. It's a misdiagnosis. And I still agree I was, I think that the brother that came up to me and wanted to kind of disagree with the leaf.

Speaker 2:

He called it alternate light.

Speaker 1:

He wanted to offer you some alternate light, yeah yeah, and gonna let that one go by and we love you brother. But I think he we were just, we were really going on semantics, I think we both agreed with each other, and that person is big on semantics, right he? Was wording it a little differently than I would have, but I think the point is right. If you disagree, send us, shoot us an email, man.

Speaker 2:

And let us know, think about it Like what that is masculine is overcoming our animal nature as men.

Speaker 1:

That's masculine Right and I've used the analogy before about about Cinderella man. You know the when he the boxer, when he he's told they didn't have enough food and his daughter said she was hungry and he had to go work 12 hours on the dock. So he made up the story about how to dream about eating a big steak and he woke up this morning just full. He couldn't eat another thing and he gave that last piece of baloney to his little girl and went off and worked eight hours on the docks on an empty stomach. That's masculinity, right? That's a picture of masculinity. That's what we. That's what we, in my opinion, that's what we're working to be. Yeah, in this, this craft of ours, we're working to be those kind of men, those not better men, better men, good men, better men, great men.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, protect, sacrifice, give more than you have, as long as it doesn't hurt you.

Speaker 1:

All right, I want to do this one. I want to do this other one because this next one is going to mean more and more as time goes on, and I'm just going to leave that one there. This one is 5.21, the three ruffians.

Speaker 2:

Oh, ok, I'm with you. You had to go in there.

Speaker 1:

I had to go in, but then all of a sudden it clicked.

Speaker 2:

Yes.

Speaker 1:

And anybody who's listening. You guys don't know what we're talking about here.

Speaker 2:

It'll click for you one day soon it will click for you.

Speaker 1:

So there are many symbolic explanations for the appearance of these three in our ritualistic drama. The attempt made to obtain a knowledge of secrets not rightfully theirs, and the dire consequences of their acts are symbolic of many things. To attempt to attain the knowledge of the divine truth by means other than as a reward for faithful service and the performance of a task of service and the performance of a task of preparing for its reception and enjoyment makes the culprit both a thief and a murderer. Thus each is reminded that rewards must be earned rather than secured by violence. The ruffians are also the passions of the self which a mason came here to subdue.

Speaker 2:

There is another symbolism, that's so interesting, isn't that good, that in the place we have these three ruffians that symbolize different things. You can look at it from several different angles, and one that they're telling you here is they represent those passions that debase us, the bad things that can kill us. They can kill us if they're left unchecked, and we have to get ahead of that. We have to get ahead of those passions inside of us and subdue them so that they don't kill the best parts of us.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and it's within the drama. It's give me what I want, but you haven't earned it.

Speaker 2:

Give me what I want.

Speaker 1:

I'm warning you Give me what I want and then in the end. This drive to circumvent hard work, honesty and integrity leads all the way to the end, which is murder. It's like and it's just such a great analogy of the passions and superfluidities within us that we must tame. Or it will kill you. Yeah, and that's what we came here to do?

Speaker 2:

We came here to subdue those. We'll die and be murdered by your own passions.

Speaker 1:

That's right and in the end bring death spiritual, even physical death, relational death, financial death and you, as a man, probably have people that rely on you.

Speaker 2:

You probably have other people that are going to get hurt if you can't get this stuff in check.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and Masonry aims to do exactly that, and that's one of the reasons why I love our craft so much. There is another symbolism quite applicable to the world of today.

Speaker 2:

I like this symbolism too.

Speaker 1:

The first of these ruffians strikes the seat of man's articulation. When man is enslaved, the first of his privileges to be denied or curtailed, is that a free speech? an unrestricted communication with his fellows. The seat of man's affections is the second area attacked. For those who would subjugate a people, oppress the families to I don't know what's going on here For those who would subjugate a people, oppress the families, to force compliance to their dictates. The third attack is made upon the seat of man's reason, For his enemies will always seek to destroy the mind as the final step towards enslavement Again this must be studied. We must go back in season two.

Speaker 2:

You'll never see a master Mason degree the same. Once you start thinking about this stuff, I'm telling, oh, and we went to an outdoor master Mason degree, which was so awesome, wow, with the tiki torches going and everything.

Speaker 1:

I was just like it was so awesome and I was paying very close attention to the three ruffians.

Speaker 2:

Why? Well, we'll find out, why oh.

Speaker 1:

OK, but yeah, very close attention. There is so much to be learned there. So much to be learned there. Though we strive to not be like them, we are them.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, we're born ruffians.

Speaker 1:

We're born ruffians man, and if the they're Masons.

Speaker 2:

The ruffians are Masons.

Speaker 1:

They're Masons. They died Masons.

Speaker 2:

They lived.

Speaker 1:

Masons as Masons and they died as Masons.

Speaker 2:

Were they good Masons.

Speaker 1:

No no.

Speaker 2:

No.

Speaker 1:

But Masons nonetheless. Wow, they were brothers, they were our brothers, that's right. Because you're always going to be a Mason.

Speaker 2:

But it's exactly what we were talking about at the beginning. There are certain Masons that want shortcuts. Yeah, right, right, yeah, and you my friend are a ruffian trying to take something you haven't earned.

Speaker 1:

And we've all done it. We've all done it, but we have to acknowledge it. If you can acknowledge, yes, I've been a ruffian in this area of my life.

Speaker 2:

Because what happens if the ruffian gets the word? What happens if the ruffian is in charge? Anything can happen, yeah dangerous times.

Speaker 1:

Bad things can happen. That's right. Anything can happen. Who knows how bad it could get.

Speaker 2:

It wouldn't be good. And that's our responsibility is to be vigilant and hold ourselves accountable and make sure that ruffians don't rise to leadership in free masonry in your lodge, in your district and in the state Right. So the first ruffian, he he he he, this is good, right, it's like a commentary on society now it really is, because the first ruffian gives up his, his free speech.

Speaker 1:

And communication with his fellows Trying to take your speech from me Right yeah. Yeah, he's trying to take it, and then the, and then the second one Trying to take your ability to create a family For those who would subjugate Watch what's happening in the degree.

Speaker 2:

Watch the areas that they're attacking on the bodies with those tools and you'll see it coincides with what this is saying, right, the first guys that died Right. And he's attacking something that's representing something else, which is society, in order to try to control you and subjugate you. Will try to take your voice and and free speech is held to such a high esteem in this country. Right, and the creators of our country recognize this and put it in writing in the beginning of our country More proof that Freemasons founded this country on the sonic principles in my view, but it's so true. And then the second, ruffian. Ok, we didn't succeed in taking away his voice, we'll just control him through his family.

Speaker 1:

Right.

Speaker 2:

And that is what a society will try to do is to control youth. They'll try to indoctrinate the youth. Right, they'll try to indoctrinate your wife to think whatever they can't get you to think.

Speaker 1:

They'll trash the economy. So you have to spend more time at work than at home, right, yeah?

Speaker 2:

Taking you away from your family.

Speaker 1:

Yeah.

Speaker 2:

And the third, Ruffian, if all else fails. Mind control. I will control your thoughts through the media, the television, the news, everything in this world. I will control your thoughts if I can't control you any other way. Wow, we have to be vigilant against these things that are happening in our society today. Every day, they try to take your voice, they try to control your family and they're definitely trying to control your mind, right?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and our craft, the work and what we're trying to do on this podcast and everything that we're trying to do with the symposiums and talking to people and the work we do within the lodge, is all about giving men the knowledge to free themselves from those Ruffians, because that's what's going to free you is understanding and wisdom and knowledge is going to free you. That's why it's called the liberal arts. It's not because their liberals are the ones teaching them. It's because it liberates you. The knowledge of the seven arts and sciences, seven liberal arts and sciences, is that. That knowledge, that understanding, will liberate you from ignorance. It will liberate you from these Ruffians, the Ruffians that are within you. They'll liberate you from it.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, wow, that's pretty impressive, huh.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, it's amazing that it's all in here, it's in our three degrees and, culminating in that last drama, and if you're an EA or a fellow craft, you've got a lot to look forward to because it's pretty amazing. And anytime I get to see a Master Mason degree I try to go because it just absolutely, it profoundly affects me every time I go. And I was sitting next to the Worshuffle Master of Inglewood Lodge shout out and I was thinking in my mind I'm never going to get tired of this and he literally said out loud as many times as I've seen this, it never gets old.

Speaker 2:

He said what you were thinking.

Speaker 1:

He said exactly what I was thinking, as we were just sitting there Vibes, total vibes, man, and it was just like oh, you're sitting outside.

Speaker 2:

It got dark, the moon was out, the torches are there.

Speaker 1:

Thus the rainstorm went right around us. We literally went around us.

Speaker 2:

Yeah you can hear the whatever animals in the dark Whipper wheel.

Speaker 1:

Is that what that was? Spare you the story of the Whipper Wheel.

Speaker 2:

Animals in the dark, the fire, the clouded canopy over our heads. It was awesome and you're in robes doing a play. That symbolizes what I mean. Look, you just said two different ways that you can look at the three Ruffians. One is that the enemy is within us.

Speaker 1:

We are the enemy.

Speaker 2:

And two is that the government could potentially be the enemy of where you live. They could be trying to control you. Or maybe not the government, but there are systems of control outside yourself trying to control you.

Speaker 1:

It's becoming pretty obvious. I mean it's certainly getting. Free speech is certainly under attack. The family is certainly under attack, regardless of how you define what a family is. It's getting harder and harder to maintain a home. Just is man, financially and even spiritually. And then that third is. Everywhere I go in this society of ours, Somebody's trying to influence me into believing what they believe over. What I know is to be true, and it's so true. The three Ruffians are alive and well and traveling all over the place. That's right.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and we have a lot of work to do. Yeah, that's right Because even if we can beat ourselves internally, we still have to deal with all this external stuff.

Speaker 1:

That's right, but it starts with awareness right.

Speaker 2:

It starts with awareness and humility. Humility too.

Speaker 1:

You have to be willing to admit it. If you can't admit that the three Ruffians live within you, then I would say start there.

Speaker 2:

Start there yes agree, Start there.

Speaker 1:

Take a look at the ritual. If you're a master mason, Take a look at the ritual. And Chris just kind of expounded upon the three of them because he knows this stuff by heart. I have to actually read it and expound about the three ideas behind each of the Ruffians and identify those things within yourself and begin to be honest enough to begin to work on those things. I know that's what I'm going to do.

Speaker 2:

This is like the pinnacle of the master mason degree, right, is the idea of these three Ruffians and the things they represent is what Freemasonry is about. In the inner-deprentice degree, you were given some tools to start to control yourself. In the fellowcraft degree, you were given the seven liberal arts and sciences, right. And if you can educate yourself, liberate your mind. Liberate your mind, yeah, and put more information in your mind to give yourself more power over yourself and your external world. And now, in the master mason degree, it's time to put all that stuff into practice in reality.

Speaker 1:

Right.

Speaker 2:

And do the work of changing, killing the Ruffians inside yourself and guarding yourself against the Ruffians you can't kill outside yourself.

Speaker 1:

Right, you can't kill those Ruffians, no.

Speaker 2:

All you can do is guard against them.

Speaker 1:

And actually in the end, the Ruffians brush up against masonry to the point where masonry will not yield to them. And I'm not going to give away. I'm saying it this way because I don't want to give away any of it. But, the three Ruffians brush up against the ultimate form of masonry that will not yield to it and, in so doing, pays the ultimate price for that. But that's not the end of the story. That is not the end of the story. That's actually the beginning of the story.

Speaker 2:

True, which I find to be True of freemasonry, isn't it so true? We were at this master mason degree in Englewood and one of the brothers stood up and said I'm so glad to be at the end of the journey. And it popped into my head immediately. And the Warsaw Master that night, bob, said you know, something's caught into his mind too. And he was like this is not the end of a journey. This is the beginning of your journey, brother. I want you to understand what's happening here.

Speaker 1:

Right.

Speaker 2:

This is just starting for you now, and the real work begins today, and this is going to be the rest of your life that you're going to be toiling away trying to kill these roughians and learn how to guard against the roughians you can't kill. He didn't say it like that, but that's what he's saying.

Speaker 1:

That's what it is.

Speaker 2:

It's the honest truth about freemasonry. That's right, that's right it is.

Speaker 1:

If it's a cult, it's the best cult I've ever heard of in my life, because I'm glad to be a cultist. It sounds like a cult Because you say I want you to work hard for me, for free.

Speaker 2:

I want you to. You know it sounds bad, right, and it could look bad too if I was thinking about that outdoor master mason degree. It could look sinister if someone was peeking through the bushes and just happened to see us, right yeah. It'd be like what in the age?

Speaker 1:

Dude, it's a clan meeting.

Speaker 2:

Oh my God, this is terrifying. It looked to me. I see the beauty in all of it right, absolutely. I see nothing but beautiful, like poetry, artistry, lessons in life, a person receiving an awakening Right, how honorable to be in the presence of another person's awakening Right. Yeah, absolutely, I just see nothing but greatness in it. But I totally could see how an outsider that doesn't understand any of the context sees evil.

Speaker 1:

Right and something scary. The characteristic of a cult is a cult will pull you away from your family, pull you away from society and bring you into this small group and not let you out of it. Free masonry we come in, but then we are encouraged to go back out and to live lives exemplary Better for a family. Better lives and be a better churchman, be a better father, be a better husband, be a better American, whatever it is to be better. That's not a cult. That's not a cult, that's a society that is a benefit to the society at large, for sure.

Speaker 2:

So well, there's this degree and this is written out so you can say it. It says it in plain English, written out in the red book, that this degree teaches us that we should live virtuous and upright lives, ever walking the path of truth and justice even though our lives may be in danger by doing that, that's right. This is what free masonry is trying to give us the ability to stand up and be upright people and walk in this broken world that we all live in as is an example of shining light, of virtue, of uprightness and justice, even though they might kill you for it. It's worth dying for to be an example.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, that's right at my alley. I mean, that speaks to me on so many levels. So well, brother, I don't know what else to say. That was some deep stuff. It was deeper than we could obviously go into during the. I want to encourage during the show, I want to encourage everybody listening. Please just grab your mentors manual and read through some of these things and ponder them, think about them, ask questions, ask questions and know what you, when I say, know what you believe and why you believe it. This is how you do it. You go in there, you read it and you formulate your worldview. How do I see the world? On what basis basis of truth do I see the world and how do I walk through that world? And that's part of it by mulling over, which is the root word for meditation is mulling is considering, deeply considering and thinking through over and over again same context and coming away with hey, this is what I believe and this is why I believe it, and always being open to learning more and more all the time and encouraging others too.

Speaker 2:

Absolutely, you gotta live it and if you live it, you will. People will want what you have once you get there. It's absolutely true.

Speaker 1:

It's absolutely true.

Speaker 2:

We were in Lodge, maybe at our last meeting. We do this thing where we give, we do Masonic trivia and we give away gift card to the winner.

Speaker 1:

Right, it's a fun thing.

Speaker 2:

It's fun, yeah, it's a nice little break in the middle of a business meeting and a newer brother raised his hand and said hey, could you like make these questions easier? Multiple choice for us new guys. And I said, hey, you need to educate yourself more.

Speaker 1:

That's right.

Speaker 2:

I'm not lowering my level of quality because you haven't done the work to meet your expectation and it's not. This was funny. It was like right right. Negative way, but in reality it's true. You need to increase your knowledge if you want to be able to participate in this stuff. It's not like we're going crazy on the trivia they're crazy.

Speaker 1:

They're pretty simple questions, Mostly out of this stuff we're talking about here. Right right, but if you have a general knowledge, if you're a master Mason, you have a general knowledge of the craft you should be able to get close to the answers of the trivia questions that you ask.

Speaker 2:

And that brother needs to step up In life. Don't let other people lower your standards and don't let them lower their own standards.

Speaker 1:

Right.

Speaker 2:

Lift them up, expect more from them so that they can learn how to expect more from themselves.

Speaker 1:

That's true and they've done studies on that that young men for the longest time. In church they were dumbing down the curriculum and the expectations of young men. They said, well, we're just giving them too much. We're giving them too much and what they found out through studies is they weren't giving them enough.

Speaker 2:

There you go they weren't challenging them.

Speaker 1:

And young men respond to challenges. If you don't challenge a young man, he's in neutral and he's gonna stay in neutral until you force him and challenge him to step up. And that's the way we were made. We were made that way to do that. And when we are challenged, we do our best. That's the way it is and that's what this craft does. It challenges us to go far beyond anything we thought we could do Memorization alone. Most people, myself included, I didn't think I could memorize anything and I've still got a long way to go, but I know now I can. You've done it, you've done it. I can do this, I can do this and I cause a huge growth in my own life, just my self-confidence and just my self-esteem to know I was in distress, brother, as an EA. I was dying A lot of people.

Speaker 2:

I was freaking out, but I did it. I did it. It's true for you too. You were probably freaking out, in part because nobody explained to you you didn't have to be perfect.

Speaker 1:

No, I was under the impression that there would be a test.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I mean you knew there was a test. But it's like to pass a test. You don't have to get 100, right?

Speaker 1:

Well, passing score is 80 or something. That would have been helpful information. Yes, I think.

Speaker 2:

I see a lot of guys and they're holding themselves to an impossible standard and it's causing so much strain and stress on themselves and it's really slowing the learning progress because you're beating yourself up so much.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I think if you just relax and do the work at your level and your ability, because everybody in the room wants you to succeed at your level and your ability anyway, but don't run away from it and don't cheat it, but just do the work at your level and what'll happen is you'll go from EA to Fellowcraft and you'll begin to grow as the craft once you and needs you to grow along the lines, because it all works together. The masonry builds upon masonry, upon masonry and it goes up and up and up all the way through to the end where you are a multi-billionaire Illuminati member financing the Bush family.

Speaker 2:

Oh my goodness, if you're a mentor, a catechism, an officer or even an elder in a lodge and you see new brothers coming in, please take the time to go explain to them that the catechism is a learning process and it's not a test.

Speaker 1:

That's right. They don't have to be perfect. It's not called a test, it's called proficiency. That's right.

Speaker 2:

I think if you can lower your guard down a little, you'll enjoy the whole process more.

Speaker 1:

I agree.

Speaker 2:

You know, hold your feet to the fire the whole time. I did the same thing.

Speaker 1:

I guess everybody kind of does, but it's good to have somebody who's already been through it just say, hey, easy, easy, have fun, enjoy this. You're only beginning. You have the rest of your life to work through all this stuff. Well, brother, I think another successful show if I can say so myself.

Speaker 2:

Do we have more of the Master Mason degree or have we come out completely serious? I think we need to do one more. No, I think we need to do one more. We have one more.

Speaker 1:

One more to do and then we will do a couple of supplementals. I've got a couple of ideas based on the emails and comments that we've been getting, getting a lot of people saying, hey, can you do this, can you do?

Speaker 2:

these different topics.

Speaker 1:

So we'll put together a couple of topical ones Seasoned with lots of esoteric teaching as well, because I know you guys love that stuff. We get lots and lots of comments Keep up the esoteric type of Masonic teaching and we will definitely do that.

Speaker 2:

We have heard you Always and we will always be doing that, but you're finally gonna get something other than Fred and Chris probably.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, we got some interviews coming up Grand Lodge, which is the 28th of this month. Last week of the month, memorial Day weekend, johnny's coming with us right and our associate producer, johnny John Schaefer is definitely coming with us. He is gonna be manning the production side of the podcast while we're there. Worshipful Chris Burns is gonna be very busy because he has a lot of different responsibilities while he's at Grand Lodge.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker 1:

So, yeah, john and I yeah, he's new, I don't know his name.

Speaker 2:

Hey Steve. Hey Steve, I mean John.

Speaker 1:

John and I will be running production. So if you're at Grand Lodge and I think most of you listening are gonna be at Grand Lodge please come find us. We have a booth set up.

Speaker 2:

This is Grand Lodge of Florida for you guys in England. Don't go to the Grand Lodge of England looking for us, Right?

Speaker 1:

yeah, come to the one in Florida, and if you do, we will definitely give you a seat up front my brother for traveling that far you get a free hat for sure. But yeah, come see us shake our hands, Let us get a picture with you, and we just wanna meet as many people as we can there. We will be doing on location interviews with some of the Grand Line. Very excited and honored about that, absolutely honored about that. That's gonna make some great content going forward into season two.

Speaker 2:

And maybe we'll get a little glimpse into what's important with the leadership of Florida. Yeah, I think so. Maybe they'll give us a little something. Yeah, I think so.

Speaker 1:

I mean we've made it clear that we're not pre-screening no, Anything. All of our questions are obviously gonna be respectful and purposeful for the benefit of the crowd. But real, but real, but real yeah yeah, but these are all great men of our craft. They really are, and these are men who have devoted their entire lives to the craft and they've made their way all the way to the Grand Line Respect. I have big respect for every single one of them and I'm looking forward to getting to know them, getting to meet them and to hang out in the hotel, in the lodge and also across the street at some of the pubs. Apparently there's a good time to be had for all there as well.

Speaker 2:

So I'm looking forward to all of that.

Speaker 1:

So if you're going, please come and find us. If you have any comments, anything that we've done good, you can shout out to us, but if there's something you disagree with, you always go to the front of the line. We thrive on disagreement. Just make sure you do it with gentleness and respect so we can all learn from it, including you and I.

Speaker 2:

And you may get a little special surprise if you come to the booth, potentially Some people might be able to see what the next level of on the level with Fred and Chris is all about. Yeah, little teaser for you to come by.

Speaker 1:

I know what you're talking about Yep pretty exciting.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, there's some things coming up here that we're very excited about.

Speaker 1:

We're not going to spring them on you yet. We're going to wait for Grand Lodge to open it up, but we've got a couple of things going Again, like Chris said, that we're pretty excited about, and I think you guys are going to love it too. So anything else, brother, before we cut out.

Speaker 2:

No, we're only. I want three weeks now from Grand Lodge. Yeah, really looking forward to meeting everybody. Please come by, say hello to John Shaefer and Fred Packwood. These people are about to take prominent roles in the state of Florida and they are, you know, outside of that, just fun people to talk to and you can get on this show there's a chance. There's a chance and you can come on the air and do a shout out if they are willing to do that with you, and I think they will be. So please come by, for them and for you and for us. We're really looking forward to meeting everybody. I've been to Grand Lodge twice already, but as a nobody, nobody knew me, so I was kind of able to stay in the. I didn't hang out with anyone, I just kind of stayed to myself. So, this is going to be a very different experience.

Speaker 1:

Very, very different. It's your first time going to Grand Lodge.

Speaker 2:

And you're going to be busy, busy, busy. You're going to be meeting, talking to the big shots.

Speaker 1:

Right.

Speaker 2:

It's going to be overwhelming for you, probably your first time out there.

Speaker 1:

I thrive on it, man, you do, give me the stage he does. It's my stage he really does.

Speaker 2:

He's like I mean everything. I'm not. He is, oh well, and I think that's why we Be thankful for that Kind of work together so well. I'm really in awe of the things that you do, and you do them so well.

Speaker 1:

Well, the feeling's mutual, brother. I think that this relationship that we have was not by accident, because we fill in the gaps that each of us lack. The gaps we lack, we fill in for each other and it works pretty well, and that's evident by the response we've gotten, literally again, from all over the world. How, who to thought, who to thought?

Speaker 2:

That's my favorite part. It is a global fraternity. We're not about our lodge being all a fringes and rea, or our district. No, we're a worldwide fraternity and we're all equal together, all of us that are Masons.

Speaker 1:

We are on the level.

Speaker 2:

All of us. So, man, you'll really feel that when you go to Grand Lodge, when you stand in a room with 1,500 Masons and a prayer said and you hear that somo to be in unison from 1,500 deep voices.

Speaker 1:

Right, yeah.

Speaker 2:

You'll get chills, I promise you it's something special.

Speaker 1:

Right, yeah, man yeah.

Speaker 2:

Come on out.

Speaker 1:

All right, so I'm coming up with a parting saying for season two. I don't know what it's going to be, but if you got any suggestions of a parting clever saying that gets us out of the podcast.

Speaker 2:

I have an idea. Well, hold on to it because I'm not asking you, I'm asking everybody to listen and to email it in and we'll try to incorporate that.

Speaker 1:

Everybody's got a cool tagline that they go out with and we go out in such a cringy kind of unprofessional way. So we're going to try to fix that in season two a little bit.

Speaker 2:

We don't want to over fix any of this.

Speaker 1:

We want it to still be crazy and as unprofessionals, we can possibly take it to.

Speaker 2:

No problem here. Yeah, no problem here either. We keep delivering that all day, every day.

Speaker 1:

All right, we could just keep talking like this for the next hour, but we're not going to my brothers all around the world, we love you, we thank you for everything you give it and we will definitely see you next time.

On the Level
Traveling in Foreign Countries in Freemasonry
Building Deep Relationships in Freemasonry
Masculinity, Toxicity, and Symbolism
Concept of Three Ruffians in Freemasonry
The Characteristics and Purpose of Freemasonry
Looking for a Parting Saying

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